From Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov Mon Oct 28 06:43:05 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id GAA19043 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 06:43:00 -0600 Received: from dcgate (dcgate.bls.gov [146.142.4.13]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id GAA02099 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 06:42:58 -0600 Message-Id: <199610281242.GAA02099@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 07:41:00 -0500 X-Mailer: NCSA Mosaic/2.0.0 Final Beta (Windows x86) X-Url: http://inside.stats.bls.gov From: Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov (Tim LaFleur) To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Where do we go from here? First a little crowing. I predicted 45-0. It wasn't that bad but it could have been worse if Saban had chosen to run up the score which, IMO, he could have. This year is history folks! Let's start getting some of the younger guys needed for next year in there. Especially at positions which need replacements. It's WAY too early to write off next year! How many of us thought we'd be in the Rose Bowl that particular year? Barry--Guess what, you will see an 8 man front with blitzing on every play until you show you can operate against that defense. Nothing new there. Every game the opponents are more extreme in their use of this defense. Do you see Saban yelling at his defense at the end of the half when they became passive!? Samuel--I remain unconvinced. It's critical to try others at QB. Nothing against him, he just isn't hitting the open receiver often enough. If the coaches are afraid he will turn it over, get someone in who you DO trust. Quitting--I don't believe the players quit for the most part. McCullough in particular ran extremely hard when given the opportunity. He probably should be in more. Red Dog looks very tired at times. It's the coaching scheme which is not allowing the players to compete. DB--What can you say? PLEASE start beating the bushes of Florida to bring in some speed. It's absolutely critical. You can't lay 20 yards off the receivers and expect to stop anybody. Tackling was atrocious against MSU mainly because DB's were too far off. They got beat deep several times anyway! Tim LaFleur From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Mon Oct 28 08:14:34 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA20438 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:14:30 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA02968 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:14:28 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:14:28 -0600 Message-Id: <199610281414.IAA02968@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:14:18 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Irony Saturday night I caught the end of the West Virginia / Miami game which I believe had the same announcers (Brad Nessler and Gary Danielson) that did the Wisconsin game the week before. For those who didn't see the ending, Miami was down 7-3, blocked a WVU punt, and ran it into the end-zone. I don't know what their play calling was before that...whether he took a knee or tried for the first down...but it does prove that anything can happen on a punt play. I didn't get to see the Badger game so I won't be able to comment. (Whitewater did crush Stevens Point at homecoming.) I do believe that the Badgers will get their first win of the season against Purdue. The Badgers still can get a bowl game if they win out and maybe...just maybe...they go 4-1. A win at Iowa, which I agree is improbable, will look good. 8-4, 4-4 is pretty good. I'm not holding my breath. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org Mon Oct 28 08:32:21 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA20718 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:32:12 -0600 Received: from vixa.voyager.net (vixa.voyager.net [198.109.136.2]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA03247 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:32:09 -0600 Received: from mailgtwy.mha.org (mailgtwy.mha.org [198.109.138.3]) by vixa.voyager.net (8.8.0/CICNet) with SMTP id JAA28669 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:31:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by mailgtwy.mha.org with Microsoft Mail id <3274D27C@mailgtwy.mha.org>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:34:20 EST From: Mark Sonneborn To: "'Bucky list'" Subject: My faith's intact Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 09:29:00 EST Message-ID: <3274D27C@mailgtwy.mha.org> Encoding: 15 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Many of you will bemoan Bucky's poor showing at MSU this week, so I won't add my beefs to it. I had a great time. I came for the brats and beer at the Badger huddle before the game, got my picture taken with Bucky, and had a 5-minute conversation with Pat Richter. I sat through the game and stayed for the fifth quarter, along with about 2/3 of the Badger fans who came. It was as rowdy a fifth quarter as ever, despite the loss. Bottom line: being a Badger fan is about having fun, win or lose. I heard an MSU fan remark that "these Badger fans don't get it--they lost." I think they're the ones who don't get it. It's more fun to win, granted, but how many schools can boast this kind of spirit in a loss? (And a bad loss at that?) From jjoyce@univbkstr.com Mon Oct 28 08:46:35 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA20995 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:46:31 -0600 Received: from mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (mrcoffee.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.70]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA03475 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:46:23 -0600 Received: from mail.univbkstr.com (mail.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.72]) by mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id IAA19885 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:04:47 -0600 Received: by mail.univbkstr.com with Microsoft Mail id <3274F32D@mail.univbkstr.com>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 09:53:49 PST From: Jason Joyce To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: Wishbone Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 08:46:00 PST Message-ID: <3274F32D@mail.univbkstr.com> Encoding: 20 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 After Saturday, I'm convinced that Badger football is just not going to be fun this year. Remember how much fun it was to watch every game in '92? I spent all of Saturday grinding my teeth, swearing at the television and moping after the game. If they're not going to win, the least they could do is entertain us. Totally new offensive scheme: run the wishbone with Marcus White at QB and Dayne and McC at back, rotate Cecil Martin and Stecker in as needed. Never throw. Use wideouts only on reverses and double reverses. A lot of laterals and pitch-outs. Use the fumble-rooski once in awhile. ============================================= Jason Joyce The University Book Store Madison, Wisconsin (608) 257-3784 http://www.univbkstr.com ========================= Turnout low for apathy forum -Daily Cardinal headline, 10/9/96 From wagnersl@norand.com Mon Oct 28 08:54:18 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA21079 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:54:13 -0600 Received: from cesium.norand.com (cesium.norand.com [136.179.160.16]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA03586 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:54:10 -0600 From: wagnersl@norand.com Received: from smtpgate.norand.com (smtpgate.norand.com [136.179.64.252]) by cesium.norand.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA20623 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:54:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from cc:Mail by smtpgate.norand.com id AA846521796; Mon, 28 Oct 96 08:54:13 CDT Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 08:54:13 CDT Message-Id: <9609288465.AA846521796@smtpgate.norand.com> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: Irony enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu writes: >Saturday night I caught the end of the West Virginia / Miami game which I >believe had the same announcers (Brad Nessler and Gary Danielson) that did >the Wisconsin game the week before. For those who didn't see the ending, >Miami was down 7-3, blocked a WVU punt, and ran it into the end-zone. I >don't know what their play calling was before that...whether he took a >knee or tried for the first down...but it does prove that anything can >happen on a punt play. That play pretty much vindicates Barry. Another interesting finish was in the Northwestern/Illinois game. Gary Barnett almost opened his own local chapter of "second-guessers anonymous." With less than 5 minutes on the clock, trailing by 3, deep in Illinois territory, and with 4th and short, Barnett elects to go for the first down rather than kick a chip-shot field goal to tie the game and at least force overtime. Schnur gets stuffed on the keeper, and the ball goes over on downs to Illinois. All Illinois has to do is click off a couple of first downs and the game is over (sound familiar?). Instead, an anemic Illinois offense goes three and out, and NU gets the ball back with about 3 minutes left on the clock. A few plays later, and NU is in the end-zone, capping their third come-back victory in a row. Shawn From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Mon Oct 28 09:07:50 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA21381 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:07:42 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA03865 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:07:40 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:07:40 -0600 Message-Id: <199610281507.JAA03865@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:07:13 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Re: My faith's intact >Bottom line: being a Badger fan is about having fun, win or lose. I heard >an MSU fan remark that "these Badger fans don't get it--they lost." I think >they're the ones who don't get it. It's more fun to win, granted, but how >many schools can boast this kind of spirit in a loss? (And a bad loss at >that?) Yep...it's gettin' to be that part of the season! "Feel good" posts like these will start appearing out of the woodwork. Good feelings can only last so long when your team is a loser...(see the late 1980s for an example.) Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From BarryR@ssec.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 09:10:02 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA21472 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:09:54 -0600 Received: from ssec.wisc.edu (ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.108.61]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA03920 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:09:53 -0600 Received: from msmail.ssec.wisc.edu (msmail.ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.116.35]) by ssec.wisc.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id JAA11918 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:09:51 -0600 Received: by msmail.ssec.wisc.edu with Microsoft Mail id <3274CCCB@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:10:03 CST From: BarryRoth To: "BuckyList " Subject: defensive backs Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:08:00 CST Message-ID: <3274CCCB@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu> Encoding: 49 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Like everyone else, I'm shocked to see how often our DBs get burned. I also agree that they bite on fakes way too much and Campbell in particular misses out on INTs and deflections because he never turns around and locates the ball. But a very big part of the problem is our pass rush. Even with 2-4 blitzers we can't seem to get any pressure on the QB any more. Saleh gets double-teamed because he's the only decent pass rusher on the team. Against NU and MSU we were blitzing almost every pass play yet Schnur and especially Schultz stood back in a huge pocket and had all day to throw. That left our DBs in man-to-man coverage trying to chase receivers like Mason and Bates around for 7 seconds. I don't think a defensive backfield full of Troy Vincents could be expected to stop a passing attack in those circumstances. On the other hand, our coaches seem to think our offense can't pass block for more than 3 seconds. How many 5-step drop back passes do we see? How many 15-25 yard patterns do we see? I think those 3-step drops, bootleg rollout passes and annoying 3-yard passes are really a sign of the coaches' lack of confidence in our pass blocking. It's pretty easy playing DB on the other team when you know UW's passing consists of 1-10 yard passes or bombs and you'll only have to stick with the receiver for 3 or 4 seconds at most. Other quick notes: 1. I've been begging for a QB draw for weeks now and they finally called one... and Samuel ran it perfectly for a 12-yard touchdown. 2. Speaking of that play, why don't our coaches use their "innovative" plays more than once per season? Examples: (a) Merritt ran an end around for about 40 yards earlier this season, (b) Hayes caught a 30 yard pass on a fake option against NU, (c) Samuel's above-mentioned QB draw against MSU. All 3 were very successful, but we haven't seem them run again. 3. Stat of the week: PSU, OSU, NU and MSU are a combined 16-3 in B10 games. Our next 4 opponents (PU, Minn, Iowa, Ill) are 5-11. This would give me cause for hope if we'd won at least one of the first four. 4. I'm even pessimistic about our chances against Purdue. Like last year (when they creamed us), they're coming off a bye week. They probably also see this as a chance to make sure they finish ahead of UW in B10 standings. 5. Did anyone see the end of the Miami-West Virginia game Saturday night on ESPN? WVU was leading 7-3 with less than a minute left and had their punt blocked and returned for a TD and lost. Even the ESPN announcers mentioned that maybe Alvarez was right to go for a first down and not punt against NU. (By the way, I saw another hail mary touchdown pass in last night's Buffalo-New England game.) From MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org Mon Oct 28 09:33:44 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA21973 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:33:39 -0600 Received: from vixa.voyager.net (vixa.voyager.net [198.109.136.2]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA04460 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:33:38 -0600 Received: from mailgtwy.mha.org (mailgtwy.mha.org [198.109.138.3]) by vixa.voyager.net (8.8.0/CICNet) with SMTP id KAA10877; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 10:33:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by mailgtwy.mha.org with Microsoft Mail id <3274E0F6@mailgtwy.mha.org>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 11:36:06 EST From: Mark Sonneborn To: enslinj Cc: "'Bucky list'" Subject: Re: My faith's intact Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:31:00 EST Message-ID: <3274E0F6@mailgtwy.mha.org> Encoding: 16 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 >Yep...it's gettin' to be that part of the season! "Feel good" posts like these will start appearing out of the woodwork. Good feelings can only last so long when your team is a loser...(see the late 1980s for an example.)< Jon, your sarcasm stings. In essence, I guess I agree with you that the late 80s sucked, and that losing sucks. I can't defend the lack of support during the Morton era, only to say that the minimum Badger fans expect is to be competitive--which they weren't. Even though this team's going nowhere, how many of us won't be watching if they're on TV or watching the ticker on HL News to get the score? As much as we hate what's going on, the key is I think we care & I don't see that changing anytime soon. We didn't care during the Morton era. From jon@intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu Mon Oct 28 09:59:35 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA22967 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:59:28 -0600 Received: from intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu (intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu [128.210.13.30]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA05069 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 09:59:25 -0600 Received: by intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu (NX5.67f2/NX3.0M) id AA06212; Mon, 28 Oct 96 11:08:09 -0500 Message-Id: <9610281608.AA06212@intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3risc v118.3) In-Reply-To: <3274CCCB@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 3.3 (Enhance 1.3) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.3) From: Jon Haveman Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 11:08:07 -0500 To: bucky@intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu Subject: Re: defensive backs Reply-To: jon@mgmt.purdue.edu References: <3274CCCB@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu> On Mon, 28 Oct 96 RE: "defensive backs" BarryRoth wrote: > Other quick notes: > 1. I've been begging for a QB draw for weeks now and they finally called > one... and Samuel ran it perfectly for a 12-yard touchdown. Was that really a QB draw? My impression was that it was just a heads-up play by Samuel. > 2. Speaking of that play, why don't our coaches use their "innovative" > plays more than once per season? Examples: (a) Merritt ran an end > around for about 40 yards earlier this season, (b) Hayes caught a 30 > yard pass on a fake option against NU, (c) Samuel's above-mentioned QB > draw against MSU. All 3 were very successful, but we haven't seem them > run again. No kidding. You're down to MSU 23-13 late in the game....try something fancy! What the hell have you got to lose? They got boring and stupid. --- Jon Haveman http://intrepid.mgmt.purdue.edu/ Asst. Prof. of Economics ,_~o jon@mgmt.purdue.edu Krannert School of Mgmt _-\_<, (317) 494-6156 (Office) Purdue University (*)/'(*) (317) 494-9658 (Fax) W. Lafayette, IN 47907-1310 (317) 742-7961 (Home) From wagnersl@norand.com Mon Oct 28 10:28:19 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA23898 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 10:28:10 -0600 Received: from cesium.norand.com (cesium.norand.com [136.179.160.16]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA05667 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 10:28:07 -0600 From: wagnersl@norand.com Received: from smtpgate.norand.com (smtpgate.norand.com [136.179.64.252]) by cesium.norand.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA21528 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 10:28:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from cc:Mail by smtpgate.norand.com id AA846527433; Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:28:24 CDT Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 10:28:24 CDT Message-Id: <9609288465.AA846527433@smtpgate.norand.com> To: wagnersl@norand.com, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: I stand corrected Forget my post about second guessing Gary Barnett in the NW/Illinois game. I mistakenly posted that NU was down by three when they had a QB sneak stuffed on 4th down. Instead they were actually down by four at that point, making it the right call. Please, no more flames. I'll shut up now. Shawn From LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Mon Oct 28 12:57:54 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA25329 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 12:57:49 -0600 Received: from shaggy.uwex.edu (shaggy.uwex.edu [144.92.105.17]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA08318 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 12:57:48 -0600 From: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Received: from charon1.uwex.edu by shaggy.uwex.edu; id AA02856; 4.1/42; Mon, 28 Oct 96 12:57:34 CST Received: From SCOOBY/WORKQUEUE by charon1.uwex.edu via Charon-4.0-VROOM with IPX id 100.961028125629.352; 28 Oct 96 12:57:35 +600 Message-Id: Organization: University of Wisconsin-Extension To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:05:14 CST Subject: Thank God it's almost basketball season! Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Mac (v2.1.2) The best thing you can say about the Badger football season is that Badger Hoops is right around the corner. I went to the scrimmage they put on yesterday at the Field House. They looked very good! Sam hit every shot he took. The confidence level on display yesterday was visably higher than last year. Hennsey was guarding Sean Mason most of the game....and it was a standoff. Hennsey and Mason are without doubt two of the best guards in the Big Ten. They had a dunking contest before the scrimmage. Booker Coleman, who took Dunking Title honors at the Alumni game on Friday night by the way, was impressive again! I know you had to be there to see it, but Coleman is nearly as impressive as, dare I say, Sam when it comes to dunking. Granted there's a big difference between a dunk contest and a Big Ten game, but Booker looks improved. He and Paul Grant were going at it in a serious way during the scrimmage. Grant showed a nice touch on the short to medium range jump shot. His offensive presence is going to be a big plus. Duany Duany has moves that will surprise ALL of you! The guy looked like a contortionist driving to the hoop a couple of times to avoid the defender....each time bringing oohs and ahhs from the crowd. Duany's another guy who will surpise you with his leaping and dunking ability. He, Booker and Sam , along with Adam Shafer are easily the best dunkers on the team. I was very impressed! I think that good things are in store for us as soon as we can get the football team off the field and into the next season! The only other thing I'll say is that despite the fact they coach in different sports, I think Barry could learn a lot from Dick Bennett. I heard Barry's comments on the radio after the MSU loss. Typical Barry stuff....took him several minutes before he finally said "it's not the kids' fault, it 's the coaching staff's fault for not having the kids prepared to play". I agree with that wholeheartedly. Did you read the quote from John Hall in yesterdays' Wisconsin State Journal? Hall talks about the whooping and hollering that was going on in the lockerroom after the game. And finishes by saying that if he were to say anything to his teammates it would be to display the emotions and intensity on the field, where it counts, not off? Different teams have different personalities depending on who their coach is. As much as I hate to admit it, becuase I hate the Cats, but Gary Barnett is a much more effective coach in getting his kids to play when the cards are stacked against them. Do you think we would've been able to rally back as the Cats did against Michigan, Wisconsin and Illinois? We just don't seem to have that ability. I think part of the problem is respect and pride. Some of you won't agree with me on this but I think Barry and his coaches spend too much time recruiting out of state. I won't argue with the Salehs, and the Dayne's and a few others, but we need a larger core of in-state kids. Kids who have grown up in Wisconsin. Kids who have played the game in Wisconsin their whole lives and honestly possess a special pride from being a Wisconsin kid and wearing the Red and White on Saturday's. Kids that don't get the high school notoriety that many of Barry's recruits get. Kids like Jeff Messenger, Scott Nelson, Mike Thompson, Chad Cascadden, Chris Hein, Joe Panos, Mike Verstegen, Cory Raymer, Brent Moss, Vince Zullo, J.C. Dawkins, etc. You want an example of how well this recipe works??? Look no further than Dick Bennett, a Wisconsin born and bred coach who takes in-state kids who are destined for a lower division college game and molds their undying heart and desire into players that play together within his system and yield the kind of results that no other coach could get out of them. Mike Kosolcharoen turned down a scholarship at UW-Green Bay, just so he could play for Dick Bennett at UW-Madison. I'll take a dozen Mike Kosolcharoen's over a dozen Rashard Giffith's any day, and I'll take a dozen Jeff Messenger's and Joe Pano's over their "imported" counterparts any day as well!!! - Dave From BadgerRoy@aol.com Mon Oct 28 13:23:30 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA25863 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:23:26 -0600 Received: from emout03.mail.aol.com (emout03.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.94]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA08892 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:23:22 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout03.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA17835; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:23:19 -0500 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:23:19 -0500 Message-ID: <961028142319_342148670@emout03.mail.aol.com> To: glaser@univbkstr.com, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: Badgers In a message dated 96-10-24 19:12:22 EDT, glaser@univbkstr.com (Thomas Glaser) writes: << Big losses: Wunsch, Vandervelt >> Have watched Vandervelt this year??? He has been very disappointing for someone with so much hype!!! Also, I dont think you can include Huntley as a "quality" returning player. He consistently is out of position, misses tackles and rarely breaks up a pass or even anywhere near a receiver. From MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org Mon Oct 28 13:33:20 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA26043 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:33:16 -0600 Received: from vixa.voyager.net (vixa.voyager.net [198.109.136.2]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA09125 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:33:15 -0600 Received: from mailgtwy.mha.org (mailgtwy.mha.org [198.109.138.3]) by vixa.voyager.net (8.8.0/CICNet) with SMTP id OAA26650 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:33:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by mailgtwy.mha.org with Microsoft Mail id <3275191D@mailgtwy.mha.org>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 15:35:41 EST From: Mark Sonneborn To: "'Bucky list'" Subject: FYI, my conversation with Pat Richter; v-ball Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 14:31:00 EST Message-ID: <3275191D@mailgtwy.mha.org> Encoding: 40 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 As I said in a previous post, I had a conversation with Pat Richter before the game against MSU. After the small talk, the conversation went something like this (I'm paraphrasing, not quoting, and this is all hearsay): Me: I+d selfishly like to see UW join the CCHA. Richter: We+re not ruling that out. With the NCAA wanting us to take on Nebraska-Omaha, and the CCHA trying to pawn off the other Alaska team on us .. . . well, we want college hockey to grow but both us and Minnesota have some concerns. It would be nice to get a sixth Big 10 team to get hockey. With six teams, you can form a conference and have tournaments. Penn State has an excellent club program, but with gender equity, it+s very unlikely they+d go varsity at this time. Me: What about getting the sixth Big 10 team by adding Notre Dame to the conference? Richter: Yeah, that would be a good way to do it. lf we can find a way to let them keep their TV football deal, I think there's a chance. Their other programs aren't as high profile and would benefit from being in the Big 10. (BTW, when I mentioned that I thought ND was in the Big East for basketball, a) he didn't seem to know that, and b) wasn't overly impressed or concerned that that put the B10 at a disadvantage. Not that it's any great shock to anyone, but the way he said things made it clear that ND would be welcome.) Well, there it is--I have dutifully reported it back to this list. Any comments? PS, I sat through the first two games of the UW-MSU V-ball match, which Bucky also lost. They play @ Jenison Field House which makes the UW Field House look like a modern facility. I thought I understood v-ball, but the refs make calls and I don't understand their hand signals and it gets put back in play so fast that you can't follow what happened. Anyway, we got smoked. From a lay person like me, it seemed like our players were trying too many dinks and too many spikes from the back row. They take about a 20 minute break after game 2, so it was about time to get my 2-year old outta there (she's scared of Sparty and the "weird guy" who's body is painted green and a big block "S" on his chest and back--good girl). From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Mon Oct 28 13:45:13 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA26412 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:45:09 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA09345 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:45:05 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:45:05 -0600 Message-Id: <199610281945.NAA09345@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:44:45 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: In-State Recruiting (was Re: Thank God it's almost basketball season!) >I think part of the problem is respect and pride. Some of you won't agree with me >on this but I think Barry and his coaches spend too much time recruiting out of >state. I won't argue with the Salehs, and the Dayne's and a few others, but we >need a larger core of in-state kids. Kids who have grown up in Wisconsin. Kids >who have played the game in Wisconsin their whole lives and honestly possess >a special pride from being a Wisconsin kid and wearing the Red and White on >Saturday's. Kids that don't get the high school notoriety that many of Barry's >recruits get. Kids like Jeff Messenger, Scott Nelson, Mike Thompson, Chad >Cascadden, Chris Hein, Joe Panos, Mike Verstegen, Cory Raymer, Brent Moss, >Vince Zullo, J.C. Dawkins, etc. The problem is that Wisconsin doesn't have that much football talent. If we are ever going to be a force nationally in football, we have to have a nation-wide recruiting presence. Barry DOES get the best in-state players every year...it still doesn't do them any good if they are not coached right. > >You want an example of how well this recipe works??? Look no further than >Dick Bennett, a Wisconsin born and bred coach who takes in-state kids who are >destined for a lower division college game and molds their undying heart and >desire into players that play together within his system and yield the kind of >results that no other coach could get out of them. Mike Kosolcharoen turned >down a scholarship at UW-Green Bay, just so he could play for Dick Bennett at >UW-Madison. I'll take a dozen Mike Kosolcharoen's over a dozen Rashard >Giffith's any day, and I'll take a dozen Jeff Messenger's and Joe Pano's over >their "imported" counterparts any day as well!!! A couple of differences: 1-You only need 12 recruits to form a basketball team...you need about 70 football recruits. The state is relatively barren in both sports, but it is easier to big a basketball program from the ground up than it is a football program. 2-Dick Bennett has recruited a number of in-state players, but he hasn't won anything yet. Outside of Okey, the best players on the UW team are not from Wisconsin. 3-Kosolcharoens will win games they are not supposed to, but they won't win championships. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From jadopke@students.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 14:00:28 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA26760 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:00:23 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA09686 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:00:22 -0600 Received: from [144.92.91.245] by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id OAA75587; 8.6.9W/42; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:00:15 -0600 Message-Id: <199610282000.OAA75587@audumla.students.wisc.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:00:54 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: jadopke@students.wisc.edu (Joel A. Dopke) Subject: "Building a wall..." >I think part of the problem is respect and pride. Some of you won't agree >with me >on this but I think Barry and his coaches spend too much time recruiting out >of >state. I won't argue with the Salehs, and the Dayne's and a few others, but >we >need a larger core of in-state kids. Kids who have grown up in Wisconsin. >Kids >who have played the game in Wisconsin their whole lives and honestly possess >a special pride from being a Wisconsin kid and wearing the Red and White on >Saturday's. Kids that don't get the high school notoriety that many of >Barry's >recruits get. Kids like Jeff Messenger, Scott Nelson, Mike Thompson, Chad >Cascadden, Chris Hein, Joe Panos, Mike Verstegen, Cory Raymer, Brent Moss, >Vince Zullo, J.C. Dawkins, etc. If we all remember, BArry came in as head coach and made the comments about "building a wall around Wisconsin" in terms of keeping the best talent in-state. I have to admit that the best talent in-state really wasn't so great during those first couple of years for Barry, but if you look at the last 2 recruiting classes, they have a very strong Wisconsin flavor. As a whole I'd say they're addressing the "keeping kids at home" issue more now than they did, but the best programs in the nation recruit nation-wide, not just at home. JD. From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Mon Oct 28 14:06:33 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA26895 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:06:29 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA09803 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:06:25 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:06:25 -0600 Message-Id: <199610282006.OAA09803@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:05:52 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Re: FYI, my conversation with Pat Richter; v-ball >Richter: We+re not ruling that out. With the NCAA wanting us to take on >Nebraska-Omaha, and the CCHA trying to pawn off the other Alaska team on us >. . . well, we want college hockey to grow but both us and Minnesota have >some concerns. It would be nice to get a sixth Big 10 team to get hockey. > With six teams, you can form a conference and have tournaments. Penn State >has an excellent club program, but with gender equity, it+s very unlikely >they+d go varsity at this time. That is good information. That he would share that with you..an unknown fan..is pretty revealing. I wouldn't be surprised if Minnesota and Wisconsin have already initiated such discussions. Or if the other Big Ten schools are interested in forming a conference with some of the other "high profile" members of the CCHA and WCHA like Tech and Northern. > >Me: What about getting the sixth Big 10 team by adding Notre Dame to the >conference? > >Richter: Yeah, that would be a good way to do it. lf we can find a way to >let them keep their TV football deal, I think there's a chance. Their other >programs aren't as high profile and would benefit from being in the Big 10. > >(BTW, when I mentioned that I thought ND was in the Big East for basketball, >a) he didn't seem to know that, and b) wasn't overly impressed or concerned >that that put the B10 at a disadvantage. ND would drop the Big East in a second if they could come to some sort of an agreement with the Big Ten. He has got to be playing his cards close to the vest...giving you the party line as it were. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov Mon Oct 28 14:12:32 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA27113 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:12:27 -0600 Received: from dcgate (dcgate.bls.gov [146.142.4.13]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA09917 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:12:19 -0600 Message-Id: <199610282012.OAA09917@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:10:17 -0500 X-Mailer: NCSA Mosaic/2.0.0 Final Beta (Windows x86) X-Url: http://inside.stats.bls.gov From: Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov (Tim LaFleur) To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Wisconsin athletes I believe, as someone who now lives out of state, that Wisconsin is decent in producing football talent. The one omission is speed which happens, IMO, to be a critical element in football. We can recruit enough size in-state to be competitive but we definitely need to supplement that from out-of-state with speed. Basketball--Wisconsin is, well, a basket case. I don't say we're the worst state there are the Alaskas and North Dakotas out there after all but we are close to the bottom. I don't see all that many in-state players on Bennett's current team either. Okey's about it. Time will tell on whether Bennett can compete in the Big 10 with non-athlete type players but I suspect he will be hard pressed to consistently finish in the top half of the conference. This even though he is certainly one of the best coaches, IMO. Try watching the Illinois, Indiana, etc state tournaments and compare that to what you get in Wisconsin. No comparison. Tim LaFleur From Mtoepit@aol.com Mon Oct 28 14:39:32 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA27781 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:39:28 -0600 Received: from emout03.mail.aol.com (emout03.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.94]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA10484 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:39:20 -0600 From: Mtoepit@aol.com Received: by emout03.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA22709 for bucky@cs.wisc.edu; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:39:15 -0500 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:39:15 -0500 Message-ID: <961028153913_1913389195@emout03.mail.aol.com> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Now I've Heard it All After the MSU game, Alvarez said that Wisconsin got "out physicaled". How can a team as big as ours be out physicaled? That must be code for, "we got our butts whipped and didn't show much fight, pretty much threw in the towel the second adversity looked us in the face." The game was certainly not a shocking result, given the previous results and the gutless nature of this crew . (previously documented) It would have been nice to see a little more fight. Forget the Bowl garbage. This team has to go 7-5 at worst so Alvarez doesn't lose any commitments and can still get some from the kids he is working on. I can already hear the OSU coaches talking to Chambers, "you really want to go to UW, they haven't won a Big 10 game" (close doesn't count) If this team totally goes in the tank (1-7 or 2-6 in Big 10), we are going to have some serious problems. Final Question. What is scarrier. All of the secondary coming back next year? Or the fact that the coaches beliieve we have nobody better to play at those positions then what is on the field? To me, both are pretty scary. One Final Thought: Leaving your heart aside, does anybody seriously think were going to beat Purdue this week? From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Mon Oct 28 15:03:05 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA28214 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:02:58 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA11031 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:02:51 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:02:51 -0600 Message-Id: <199610282102.PAA11031@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:02:20 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Mtoepit@aol.com, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Re: Now I've Heard it All >One Final Thought: Leaving your heart aside, does anybody seriously think >were going to beat Purdue this week? > Yeah, I do. I think Purdue really isn't that good and all frustrations are going to come out on the field. The Badgers will dominate the game and win something like 28-10. I'm not one to "go with my heart," but I think this 0-4 thing will become more of a motivating factor. I know Purdue has had two weeks to prepare, but Bucky has revenge on their side. Purdue also doesn't have Alstott anymore. Wisconsin isn't THAT bad. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From jjoyce@univbkstr.com Mon Oct 28 15:58:25 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA28796 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:58:18 -0600 Received: from mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (mrcoffee.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.70]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA12007 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:58:16 -0600 Received: from mail.univbkstr.com (mail.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.72]) by mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id PAA22317 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:16:49 -0600 Received: by mail.univbkstr.com with Microsoft Mail id <32755872@mail.univbkstr.com>; Mon, 28 Oct 96 17:05:54 PST From: Jason Joyce To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: RE: Now I've Heard it All Date: Mon, 28 Oct 96 15:57:00 PST Message-ID: <32755872@mail.univbkstr.com> Encoding: 28 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Jon wrote: Wisconsin isn't THAT bad. You didn't watch the MSU game, did you? It was painful. Very painful. If we score 7 before the Boilers do, I think we might restore some confidence. However, if Purdue scores first, we're screwed. We showed some brilliance in coming from behind against Northwestern, but there was absolutely no fight once MSU pulled ahead on Saturday. Wisconsin was good a few weeks ago, but Saturday's team was a mere shell of the team that played OSU. I don't see that changing unless Barry shakes things up this week. I honestly think these guys have a terrible attitude right now. When you're winning, you think you can accomplish anything. But when you've been beaten like a rabid dog four straight weeks, you have no optimism. They need to start going for broke. Unfortunately, the Alvarez game plan is so plodding and depressing, I fear these guys will never break out of this funk. ============================================= Jason Joyce The University Book Store Madison, Wisconsin (608) 257-3784 http://www.univbkstr.com ========================= Turnout low for apathy forum -Daily Cardinal headline, 10/9/96 From slickmjo@terracom.net Mon Oct 28 16:52:54 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA00103 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:52:49 -0600 Received: from mendota.terracom.net (mendota.terracom.net [205.213.64.2]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA12997 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:52:48 -0600 Received: from 205.213.64.143 (pm2_13.terracom.net [205.213.64.143]) by mendota.terracom.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id QAA26835; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:56:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <327539BE.6863@terracom.net> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:54:54 -0600 From: Mike X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu CC: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: Re: Thank God it's almost basketball season! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was also at the Badger scrimage and yes, they look impressive. Offense and defense looked alittle bit smother and everything looked well executed. It is extremlly odvious that they have been lifting over the summer. Anyone who saw Okey would be afraid to meet him in a dark alley. He has grown to the size of a brick shit house. Booker Colemen looked bigger and stronger. I think that size advantage is really going to help. Except for the new comers, I thought the shots were better. Mike K. was hitting threes left and right. Sean Daugherty's shot has improved, from the inside and out. Okey's shot is wonderful. He was hitting the three plus he had some great moves in the paint. I talked to Sean Daugherty after the game and he said that they didn't play well but they played with intensity. Well, if the preformance they showed us wasn't the best, imagine what they'll look like when they are playing their best. Mike From smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 17:05:09 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA00373 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 17:05:02 -0600 Received: from humvee.doit.wisc.edu (humvee.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.20]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA13217 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 17:05:00 -0600 From: smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Received: from [144.92.184.107] by humvee.doit.wisc.edu; id QAA06770; 8.7.5/50; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:32:20 -0600 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:32:20 -0600 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Maybe it's just me, but there are times like this where one can see a difference between Packer fans and Badger fans (the two aren't mutually exclusive a person can and very often is both). I don't want to throw too many of the "we can't win them all clich=E9s" out there, but some of them fit. No matter what this team does, I will remember them for playing well enough to beat 3 top 10 teams, including one (OSU) it had no business even being in the game with talent wise. The coaching staff lost (or at least and probably more accurately could have won but didn't) three games. Yes the team finally showed signs of the heartbreaking losses and rolled over against MSU. They'll bounce back. The Rose Bowl was not a fluke. God, I can't even believe I read that from some one on this list. There was some luck involved, but for the most part, a group of talent players played up to their ability, a number of them played beyond theirs, and the coaching staff did a good job. The Chemistry and talent and other stuff you can't define all came together. So the program is in a rougher spot than it's been in in a few years, (and really we're only a few years removed from the Morton years). Barry has show he can recruit good players. He's done that from the very beginning when there were a lot less reasons for recruits to come here to play. He's shown he has weaknesses and if he doesn't get a better supporting cast of coaches, the program will not go to the next level. But Wisconsin football is not dead. Reeling a little bit yes, but did anyone really think that we were going to have a Nebraska or Notre Dame type of consistancy in a few years? Step back and look at it all from a distance, there's a lot of programs that would love to be where the Badger football program is. I'm sure I'll get flamed for this because I'm too optimistic, but I don't care, I needed to get it out. steve snyder From tschwant@students.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 18:42:51 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA01290 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:42:46 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA14544 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:42:45 -0600 Received: from F209-039.net.wisc.edu by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id SAA59363; 8.6.9W/42; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:42:31 -0600 Message-ID: <327580A5.C1D@students.wisc.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:57:25 -0800 From: Travis Organization: University of Wisconsin X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: My faith's intact References: <3274D27C@mailgtwy.mha.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark Sonneborn wrote: > I had a great time.... I sat through the game and stayed for the > fifth quarter, along with about 2/3 of the Badger fans who came. It was as > rowdy a fifth quarter as ever, despite the loss. > > Bottom line: being a Badger fan is about having fun, win or lose. I heard > an MSU fan remark that "these Badger fans don't get it--they lost." I think > they're the ones who don't get it. It's more fun to win, granted, but how > many schools can boast this kind of spirit in a loss? (And a bad loss at > that?) Man, I'm glad you wrote that. That's a pretty rare bottom line to have these days - makes me glad to be from the UW. I made the drive with some friends to East Lansing from Madison and really had a good time. The loss was really, really bad but at least this week we had about the whole 4th quarter to cycle through the five stages of grief. This team has been disappointing. But I'm glad Badger fans still have fun. I walked out of the stadium after the 5th quarter with a huge smile on my face. It's easy to be a fan when you win, but Wisconsin fans tend to have fun regardless. Many MSU fans came up to us with astonished looks on their faces after the 5th quarter. We had less of a team than MSU but we definently had more fun. [back to regularly scheduled pulling-our-hair-out] On Wisconsin, Travis From tschwant@students.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 18:44:16 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA01294 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:44:12 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA14571 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:44:10 -0600 Received: from F209-039.net.wisc.edu by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id SAA17638; 8.6.9W/42; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:44:02 -0600 Message-ID: <32758103.7839@students.wisc.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:58:59 -0800 From: Travis Organization: University of Wisconsin X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: My faith's intact References: <199610281507.JAA03865@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jonathan C. Enslin wrote: > Yep...it's gettin' to be that part of the season! "Feel good" posts like > these will start appearing out of the woodwork. > > Good feelings can only last so long when your team is a loser...(see the > late 1980s for an example.) I'm as guilty of these feel good posts as anyone. You're right about your last sentence on a mass level (I'd be surprised if actual attendence at the Purdue game tops 70,000), but I disagree with you on an individual level. In fact, I think since the late 70s - and through the Morton years - Wisconsin has always had a base of fans who went solely for the fun, win or lose. I know because I'm one of them. It's not a stupid blind loyalty thing or a masochistic I-like-to-lose mentality, it's more just the plain enjoyment and uniqueness football Saturdays in Madison. On Wisconsin, Travis From bcpietz@students.wisc.edu Mon Oct 28 19:43:22 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA02413 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:43:18 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA15459 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:43:16 -0600 Received: from F209-045.net.wisc.edu by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id QAB38070; 8.6.9W/42; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:49:31 -0600 Message-Id: <199610282249.QAB38070@audumla.students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: bcpietz@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:31:40 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: "Bradley C. Pietz" Subject: Purdue Tickets As crazy as it may sound I need 6 tickets to the Purdue game this weekend. If you can help please e-mail me directly. Brad Pietz bcpietz@students.wisc.edu Brad Pietz bcpietz@students.wisc.edu From Alan.Rieck@nau.edu Mon Oct 28 19:51:29 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA02524 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:51:25 -0600 Received: from logjam.ucc.nau.edu (mailgate.nau.edu [134.114.96.14]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA15592 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 19:51:23 -0600 Received: from [134.114.10.19] (mac58.cca.nau.edu) by NAUVAX.UCC.NAU.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #18805) id <01IB6QD2IS1S02Q1B1@NAUVAX.UCC.NAU.EDU> for bucky@cs.wisc.edu; Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:51:21 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 18:50:29 -0700 From: Alan.Rieck@nau.edu (Alan Rieck) Subject: Re: Thank God it's almost basketball season! To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Could someone that was at the Bball scrimmage fill us in as to how Paul Grant looked? They really need to find a body that can fill the middle and pull down some boards. Did they break much (fully remembering that Dick Bennett is coaching) when they had the opportunity? Thanks for the update. On Wisconsin!! From BarryR@ssec.wisc.edu Tue Oct 29 08:28:39 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA07300 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:28:34 -0600 Received: from ssec.wisc.edu (ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.108.61]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA22506 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:28:32 -0600 Received: from msmail.ssec.wisc.edu (msmail.ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.116.35]) by ssec.wisc.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id IAA43483 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:28:31 -0600 Received: by msmail.ssec.wisc.edu with Microsoft Mail id <3276067E@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu>; Tue, 29 Oct 96 08:28:30 CST From: BarryRoth To: "BuckyList " Subject: more hoops questions Date: Tue, 29 Oct 96 08:24:00 CST Message-ID: <3276067E@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu> Encoding: 10 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 A couple other questions for those who went to the basketball scrimmage... 1. How did the new JC-transfer point guard (Ty Calderwood) look? 2. Was Mosezell Peterson there? If so, how was he moving around? (I know he's out for the seaon with his severe knee injury - I'm just curious as to whether he was there as part of the team.) Barry From jadopke@students.wisc.edu Tue Oct 29 08:47:14 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA07527 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:47:09 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA22782 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:47:08 -0600 Received: from [144.92.91.245] by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id IAA70503; 8.6.9W/42; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:47:06 -0600 Message-Id: <199610291447.IAA70503@audumla.students.wisc.edu> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 08:47:43 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: jadopke@students.wisc.edu (Joel A. Dopke) Subject: Hoops >Could someone that was at the Bball scrimmage fill us in as to how Paul >Grant looked? They really need to find a body that can fill the middle and >pull down some boards. Did they break much (fully remembering that Dick >Bennett is coaching) when they had the opportunity? My impressions were of another Jeff Peterson...more smart than athletic, a tall body without a lot of bulk, nice jumper out to about 15 feet. This was the player they missed after the NCAA season because he was big, could play in the paint and on the perimeter. JD. From LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Tue Oct 29 09:19:40 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA08108 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:19:36 -0600 Received: from shaggy.uwex.edu (shaggy.uwex.edu [144.92.105.17]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA23378 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:19:35 -0600 From: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Received: from charon1.uwex.edu by shaggy.uwex.edu; id AA03514; 4.1/42; Tue, 29 Oct 96 09:19:33 CST Received: From SCOOBY/WORKQUEUE by charon1.uwex.edu via Charon-4.0-VROOM with IPX id 100.961029091823.352; 29 Oct 96 09:19:31 +600 Message-Id: Organization: University of Wisconsin-Extension To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:27:12 CST Subject: Re: Hoops Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Mac (v2.1.2) >>Could someone that was at the Bball scrimmage fill us in as to how Paul >>Grant looked? They really need to find a body that can fill the middle and >>pull down some boards. Did they break much (fully remembering that Dick >>Bennett is coaching) when they had the opportunity? > >My impressions were of another Jeff Peterson...more smart than athletic, a >tall body without a lot of bulk, nice jumper out to about 15 feet. This >was the player they missed after the NCAA season because he was big, could >play in the paint and on the perimeter. > >JD. > I disagree with the above impression. I was at the scrimmage on Sunday and I was much more impressed with Paul Grant's physical nature than Joel was. Grant is listed at 7'0", 245, and this time folks, the stats ain't lying! I think you're going to see a very physical player in Paul Grant. A guy who isn't going to be afraid to mix it up against anyone. Definitely not a Jeff Peterson type. I think Joel's observations about Grant's atheltic ability is also short changed. Judging by the leaping ability he demonstrated in the dunking exhibition alone, he's a guy who's not afraid to take it to the hoop or take the 15 foot J. \ I think as the season begins you'll see these same talents in Paul Grant. There's no doubt in my mine that he along with Sam and Sean will form one of the best back courts in all the Big Ten. I like our starting five in a big way too. Picture Sean Mason and Hennssy Auriantal at guards, (either one can play the point), Paul Grant in the middle at 7'0", 245 lbs., Sam Okey, (6'7", 240 lbs.) at one forward and Sean Daugherty, (6'10", 230 lbs.) at the other forward. Nice! Very nice! They also have the makings of a strong bench, especially at guard. You have Ty Calderwood, Adam Shafer and swingmen Duany Duany and Mike Kosolcharoen. A seemingly much improved Booker Coleman is back at forward/center at 6'9", 230 lbs., and another guy who impressed me at the scrimmage was a walk on by the name of Matt Quest, a 6-6, 230 lb., junior forward from Watertown. He hit the boards with authority and played taller that he is. I felt sorry for Mosezell Peterson. He had to watch from the bench in civies. He was one guy I wanted to talk to afterwards during the autograph session but I ran out of time. I hope he can make it back next year. He's listed as a redshirt on this year's roster. - Dave From LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Tue Oct 29 09:24:13 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA08175 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:24:07 -0600 Received: from shaggy.uwex.edu (shaggy.uwex.edu [144.92.105.17]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA23477 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:24:06 -0600 From: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Received: from by shaggy.uwex.edu; id AB03544; 4.1/42; Tue, 29 Oct 96 09:24:04 CST Received: From SCOOBY/WORKQUEUE by charon1.uwex.edu via Charon-4.0-VROOM with IPX id 100.961029092355.640; 29 Oct 96 09:24:02 +600 Message-Id: Organization: University of Wisconsin-Extension To: BarryR@ssec.wisc.edu, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:32:31 CST Subject: Re: more hoops questions Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Mac (v2.1.2) \>A couple other questions for those who went to the basketball scrimmage... > >1. How did the new JC-transfer point guard (Ty Calderwood) look? He looked a bit tentative in front of the fan base for the first time. To his credit he looks like a good ball handler, definitely able to handle the point, although probably in a back up role at least to start the season because of the ball handling abilities of Sean Mason and Hennssy Auriantal. I don't remember him taking many shots during the game. I watched his form for a while during the shooting drills and he didn't seem to be on. >2. Was Mosezell Peterson there? If so, how was he moving around? (I know > he's out for the seaon with his severe knee injury - I'm just curious > as to whether he was there as part of the team.) Mosezell was there. Watched the game from the bench. Seems to walk o.k. Looks good in the team picture. But unfortunately I ran out of time and didn't get a chance to talk to him to ask him about his rehab schedule afterwards during the autograph session. - Dave From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Tue Oct 29 09:50:37 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA08782 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:50:32 -0600 Received: from io.che.wisc.edu (io.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.39]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA24001 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:50:31 -0600 Received: by io.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/15Jun95-0428PM) id AA03170; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:50:30 -0600 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:50:30 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610291550.AA03170@io.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu, smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Subject: Optimism Steve Snyder wrote: > The Rose Bowl was not a fluke. God, I can't even believe I read that from > some one on this list. There was some luck involved, but for the most > part, a group of talent players played up to their ability, a number of > them played beyond theirs, and the coaching staff did a good job. The > Chemistry and talent and other stuff you can't define all came together. I think you can wrap up the Rose Bowl season with one name: Joe Panos. Sure, there were a LOT of people that played well on that team, and it was quite a team, but Joe's personality, enthusiasm, and desire had to rub off on the other players. What Wisconsin needs is another Joe Panos. Unfortunately, I think a lot of him came from his beginnings: a walk-on on a 1-10 team. Maybe this season will rub off on some of the younger guys so it will help them later on. > I'm sure I'll get flamed for this because I'm too optimistic, but I don't > care, I needed to get it out. What I find sort of ironic is many of the people that I used to think were unreasonably optimistic are among the most pessimistic right now. My attitude towards this team hasn't changed that much, nor has yours. I think they had a horrible schedule, to be honest. If we had a Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, or Minnesota intermixed with the Ohio State, Penn State, and Northwestern games, it might have made a big difference. Brian From jadopke@students.wisc.edu Tue Oct 29 10:15:20 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA09096 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:15:15 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA24390 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:15:14 -0600 Received: from [144.92.91.245] by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id KAA06726; 8.6.9W/42; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:15:09 -0600 Message-Id: <199610291615.KAA06726@audumla.students.wisc.edu> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:15:48 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: jadopke@students.wisc.edu (Joel A. Dopke) Subject: schedule >What I find sort of ironic is many of the people that I used to think were >unreasonably optimistic are among the most pessimistic right now. My >attitude towards this team hasn't changed that much, nor has yours. I >think they had a horrible schedule, to be honest. If we had a Purdue, >Indiana, Illinois, or Minnesota intermixed with the Ohio State, Penn State, >and Northwestern games, it might have made a big difference. I couldn't agree more. It's hard to keep the intensity up when you play one powerhouse after another and come up short. A game that may be classified as a likely win in the middle of that tough run could've made a world of difference in terms of keeping the team's morale up. Speaking of team morale, somebody said something about scoring first against Purdue going a long way toward winning the game. It appears that is a must. I don't know the emotional state of this team right now (I haven't been in the locker room or hung out with the players), but you have to believe that if this team can come out and dominate Purdue, there is still hope for a winning season (7-8 wins). Not only that, I think they will need that confidence going into the Minnesota game against a team that will directly attack the Badgers' lackluster secondary. The Badgers haven't matched up well against Purdue and Minnesota over the last couple of years, but they have their backs against the wall. They did last week, too. JD. From jjoyce@univbkstr.com Tue Oct 29 10:30:49 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA09265 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:30:43 -0600 Received: from mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (mrcoffee.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.70]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA24608 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:30:41 -0600 Received: from mail.univbkstr.com (mail.univbkstr.com [199.183.133.72]) by mrcoffee.univbkstr.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA25802 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 09:49:32 -0600 Received: by mail.univbkstr.com with Microsoft Mail id <32765D46@mail.univbkstr.com>; Tue, 29 Oct 96 11:38:46 PST From: Jason Joyce To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: RE: Optimism Date: Tue, 29 Oct 96 10:30:00 PST Message-ID: <32765D46@mail.univbkstr.com> Encoding: 26 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 I'm not sure Panos would even make it on to the Badgers today. He obviously didn't develop as a big lineman until college and took a big risk transferring to UW from Whitewater. Here's an interesting question: would it be worth it for UW coaches to take a look at smaller state schools where quality players who are smaller or slower in high school end up? How many potential Panoses are out there? If we only get 1-2 years of starts out of linemen, could it be useful to look at smaller programs for guys who were late bloomers? Brian wrote: What Wisconsin needs is another Joe Panos. Unfortunately, I think a lot of him came from his beginnings: a walk-on on a 1-10 team. Maybe this season will rub off on some of the younger guys so it will help them later on. ============================================= Jason Joyce The University Book Store Madison, Wisconsin (608) 257-3784 http://www.univbkstr.com ========================= Turnout low for apathy forum -Daily Cardinal headline, 10/9/96 From jdavis@sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu Tue Oct 29 10:59:10 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA09704 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:58:55 -0600 Received: from sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu (sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu [128.210.73.41]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA25119 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 10:58:45 -0600 Received: from grad01.pctx.purdue.edu (grad01.pctx.purdue.edu [128.210.73.77]) by sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu (8.6.12/3.5davy/jsmith) with SMTP id LAA16839; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:57:33 -0500 Message-Id: <199610291657.LAA16839@sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:57:33 -0500 X-Sender: jdavis@sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu From: jdavis@sparky.pharmacy.purdue.edu (John Davis) Subject: Re: Optimism Cc: bucky@cs.wisc.edu X-Mailer: Bingo! When they went to the Rose Bowl a lot of people figured Bucky to start 7-0 (only a loss against Minnesota prevented that). By the time UW got to Michigan and tOSU they were playing with a ton of confidence. They traversty of the Minnesota game brought them back down to Earth just in time for the real meat of the schedule. It also didn't hurt that although they played Michigan and tOSU back-to-back, they were home games. Don't forget, Illinois was also prjected to be a top four finisher in the Big Ten that year. And by the time they got to Michigan State-forget about it. jd-way over analyzing things! >think they had a horrible schedule, to be honest. If we had a Purdue, >Indiana, Illinois, or Minnesota intermixed with the Ohio State, Penn State, >and Northwestern games, it might have made a big difference. > >Brian > > From Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov Tue Oct 29 11:04:38 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA09811 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:04:16 -0600 Received: from dcgate (dcgate.bls.gov [146.142.4.13]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA25245 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:04:15 -0600 Message-Id: <199610291704.LAA25245@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 12:02:16 -0500 X-Mailer: NCSA Mosaic/2.0.0 Final Beta (Windows x86) X-Url: http://inside.stats.bls.gov From: Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov (Tim LaFleur) To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Optimism-Pessimism I don't think anybody should be surprised that the most optimistic members of this list in the early season are now the most pessimistic. Presumably, the optimists had the highest expectations and then seen them dashed. What bothers me is the inability of the coaching staff to correct things. The trend in College Football, as in the pros, is now to stuff the run with multiple players at the line of scrimmage, run blitzes and DBs playing in-your-face coverage. I saw Tennessee beat Alabama by throwing a 2-yard pass which was run in about 70 yards for the score because 'Bama was spread out. Quite frankly, this has been going on all season. We had trouble moving even against Eastern Michigan. If they had had better players to execute the defense they might have won the game. It is now obvious the coaches have no answer to this type of defense. Thus the pessimism. The offense seemingly is getting worse. Only 1 TD the last two weeks (NU gave us two). The coaching staff needs to rethink this offense for next year because something has to give. From morse@globaldialog.com Tue Oct 29 11:30:38 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA10424 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:30:29 -0600 Received: from msn.globaldialog.com (msn.globaldialog.com [156.46.122.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA25788 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:30:27 -0600 Received: from s24a.globaldialog.com (s24a.globaldialog.com [156.46.122.88]) by msn.globaldialog.com (8.8.2/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA15347 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:30:29 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:30:29 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199610291730.LAA15347@msn.globaldialog.com> X-Sender: morse@pop.globaldialog.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: morse@globaldialog.com (Bob Morse) Subject: Re: Optimism >What I find sort of ironic is many of the people that I used to think were >unreasonably optimistic are among the most pessimistic right now. Hmmm. Anyone in particular? >I think they had a horrible schedule, to be honest. If we had a Purdue, >Indiana, Illinois, or Minnesota intermixed with the Ohio State, Penn State, >and Northwestern games, it might have made a big difference. Sorry to disagree, but I thought the schedule was perfect. I still say we have the talent and depth, and the first three non-conf games gave Mikey the time he needed to learn the system and develop enough confidence to compete effectively in conf play. The players have simply been shortchanged by the coaches. One more time, with feeling: With (1) better play-calling and (2) better adaptability in the D schemes (2ndary coverages), the Badgers would be 7-0 now, ranked among the top 6 or 7 nationally, and headed for Pasadena at 12-0. It's unfortunate the players lost their heart at MSU, but I really can't blame them considering what they'd had to endure through the preceding three games. Anyone have any more dead horses I could whip? =================================================================== Bob Morse , Badger SoftWerks, Mt. Horeb, WI From shawkes@indiana.edu Tue Oct 29 11:58:04 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA11516 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:57:38 -0600 Received: from roatan.ucs.indiana.edu (roatan.ucs.indiana.edu [129.79.10.65]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA26320 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 11:57:36 -0600 Received: from ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu (shawkes@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu [129.79.10.44]) by roatan.ucs.indiana.edu (8.7.3/8.7.3/1.12IUPO) with ESMTP id MAA11082 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 12:57:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (from shawkes@localhost) by ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu (8.7.6/8.7/regexp($Revision: 1.3 $) id MAA27978; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 12:57:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 12:57:28 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen Mccauley Hawkes X-Sender: shawkes@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: Tapes of '93 season Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII As I sat watching the Badgers lose to Michigan State on Saturday I felt an overpowering need to watch a couple of the '93 Badger games - I can see Moss bursting up the middle right now... Unfortunately I couldn't, because I don't have any videos of the season. Does anyone have video tapes of the '93 season that they'd be willing to copy? I would like to have a copy of a couple of the games, possibly Ohio State, Illinois... I'd be happy to send a blank tape in a SASE to anyone that would be willing to tape these games for me. I wish I had thought of this about 3 years ago. Steve Hawkes UW '91 From Adam.S.Bass@students.Miami.EDU Tue Oct 29 13:48:21 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA14084 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 13:48:14 -0600 Received: from email.ir.miami.edu (email.ir.miami.edu [129.171.32.80]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA28386 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 13:48:12 -0600 Received: by email.ir.miami.edu id AA03047 (5.65c+/IDA-1.4.4 for Wisconsin mailing list ); Tue, 29 Oct 1996 14:47:52 -0500 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 14:47:50 -0500 (EST) From: "Adam S. Bass" Subject: PREDICTION To: Wisconsin mailing list Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII OK, I'm going to be the first person to predict it, you heard it here first: After starting out 3-4, Wisconsin will finish the season at 8-4 by running the table, including the team's first win since before the dawn of time at Iowa. It starts with an absolute pasting of Purdue this weekend. 49-10 Adam S. Bass abass@email.ir.miami.edu On Wisconsin! From WEILER_DONALD_G@Lilly.com Tue Oct 29 15:26:14 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA00742 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 15:25:59 -0600 Received: from Lilly.com (inet.d48.lilly.com [40.33.1.1]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA00198 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 15:25:57 -0600 Received: from mr.lilly.com by INET.D48.LILLY.COM (PMDF V5.0-6 #15017) id <01IB7ZIUJTRK00978A@INET.D48.LILLY.COM> for bucky@cs.wisc.edu; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 16:25:16 -0500 (EST) Received: with PMDF-MR; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 21:24:04 +0000 (GMT) MR-Received: by mta MAI01.MUAS; Relayed; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 21:24:04 +0000 MR-Received: by mta MAI01C; Relayed; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 21:24:08 +0000 MR-Received: by mta MCDEV1; Relayed; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 21:24:50 +0000 Disclose-recipients: prohibited Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 21:24:04 +0000 (GMT) From: WEILER DONALD G Subject: Re: PREDICTION In-reply-to: To: Badger List Address Message-id: <1204241629101996/A23222/MAI01C/11AAEC180200*@MHS> Autoforwarded: false MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: normal Priority: normal Sensitivity: Company-Confidential UA-content-id: 11AAEC180200 X400-MTS-identifier: [;1204241629101996/A23222/MAI01C] Hop-count: 2 >OK, I'm going to be the first person to predict it, you heard it here first: > >After starting out 3-4, Wisconsin will finish the season at 8-4 by >running the table, including the team's first win since before the dawn >of time at Iowa. > >It starts with an absolute pasting of Purdue this weekend. 49-10 I am still optomistic, but I think the Badgers will lose one to either Illinois or Iowa. 7-5 overall. I trek north for one game every fall and it is usually a Bucky blowout. That trend will continue this year as the Badgers clean out the cobwebs against the Boilermakers. Badgers 38, Purdue 14. From LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Tue Oct 29 16:30:37 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA01956 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 16:30:26 -0600 Received: from shaggy.uwex.edu (shaggy.uwex.edu [144.92.105.17]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA01460 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 1996 16:30:25 -0600 From: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Received: from bambam.nadn.navy.mil by shaggy.uwex.edu; id AB06377; 4.1/42; Tue, 29 Oct 96 16:29:07 CST Received: From SCOOBY/WORKQUEUE by charon1.uwex.edu via Charon-4.0-VROOM with IPX id 100.961029155131.416; 29 Oct 96 16:29:08 +600 Message-Id: Organization: University of Wisconsin-Extension To: Adam.S.Bass@students.Miami.edu, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 17:00:04 CST Subject: Re: PREDICTION Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Mac (v2.1.2) >OK, I'm going to be the first person to predict it, you heard it here first: > >After starting out 3-4, Wisconsin will finish the season at 8-4 by >running the table, including the team's first win since before the dawn >of time at Iowa. > >It starts with an absolute pasting of Purdue this weekend. 49-10 > > >Adam S. Bass >abass@email.ir.miami.edu > Let me be the first to ask if you'd like to put your money where your mouth is. I can see you now, telling General Custer something about Indians having bad aim as they charged bow and arrow at the ready. True, anything can happen anytime two teams take the field. And the Hawkeyes could lose several key starters to injury before the game at Iowa City, but I see very little reason to think we can beat Iowa. I think we're going to have our hands full with every conference game we have left. I expect every game to be a struggle. I think Purdue, Minnesota and Illinois, not to mention Iowa, could beat us. I honestly feel we'll be lucky, very lucky if we only lose one more game this season. I'd say 3-2 is more probable. You can call it pessimistic. I call it the ugly truth. - Dave From bresinmp@adam.cs.uwec.edu Wed Oct 30 01:54:22 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id BAA06822 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 01:54:18 -0600 Received: from adam.cs.uwec.edu (adam.cs.uwec.edu [137.28.109.6]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id BAA08806 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 01:54:16 -0600 Received: by adam.cs.uwec.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/17Aug95-1218PM) id AA12056; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 01:54:09 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 01:54:09 -0600 (CST) From: Mike To: "Bucky Badger's Followers Followers" Subject: Minnesota vs Wisconsin game notes excerpt (fwd) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 17:44:20 -0600 From: Men's Intercollegiate Athletics To: Multiple recipients of list INFO-HOCKEY-L Subject: Minnesota vs Wisconsin game notes excerpt As usual, the entire release with links to players' bios and updated stats can be found at: http://gophersports.umn.edu/ Dane County Coliseum - Madison, Wis. Friday, Nov. 1, 1996 - Faceoff: 7:05 p.m. (Central) Saturday, Nov. 2, 1996 - Faceoff: 7:05 p.m. (Central) Television: Midwest Sports Channel (MSC) will broadcast the Wisconsin series live (Frank Mazocco, Tom Reid, Ryan Lefebvre). Radio: KSTP-AM 1500 (live all Minnesota games) (Dan Terhaar, Tom Vannelli, Robb Leer, Glen Sonmor) Series vs. Badgers: The games this weekend will mark the 191st and 192nd meetings in the series. The Golden Gophers lead the series 113-64-13, and have won 18 of the last 25 (18-5-2) meetings between the two clubs. The Badgers did sweep the Golden Gophers last season in Madison, the first Wisconsin sweep of Minnesota in nearly 10 years (1/31 - 2/1/86). Minnesota leads 113-64-13 Last 10 games - MN 7-3-0 First meeting - 1/15/23, MN 3-0 Last meeting - 3/8/96, MN 4-3 (ot) Minnesota's longest win streak - 9 Wisconsin's longest win streak - 5 '90's - MN 20-7-3 '80's - MN 35-22-2 '70's - WIS 25-20-3 '60's - MN 8-3-1 '50's - DNP '40's - DNP '30's - MN 8-5-0 '20's - MN 22-2-4 Golden Gophers Last Weekend: Minnesota salvaged a split of a league weekend series at UMD, winning 4-3 Saturday after dropping a 7-4 decision Friday night. Badgers Last Weekend: Wisconsin split a series at Denver, defeating the Pioneers 8-3 Friday before losing their second one-goal game of the young season by the count of 3-2 on Saturday. Minnesota Wisconsin 2-2-0 Overall Record 2-2-0 2-2-0 (T-3rd) Conference Record/Place 2-2-0 (T-3rd) 4-19 (.211) Power Play/Pct 3-19 (.158) 20-22 (.909) Penalty Kill/Pct 17-21 (.810) 1-1-0 vs. Top 10 Teams 0-0-0 7-3-0 Last 10 Games 6-4-0 -- Men's Intercollegiate Athletics University of Minnesota Twin Cities Campus 612-625-4090 mica@mica.email.umn.edu INFO-HOCKEY-L is for information only; send any discussion of this article to HOCKEY-L@MAINE.MAINE.EDU, The College Hockey Discussion List. From tweaver@escmail.orl.lmco.com Wed Oct 30 10:02:53 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA14002 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:02:35 -0600 Received: from orl.lmco.com (theopolis.orl.mmc.com [141.240.10.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12758 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:02:31 -0600 From: tweaver@escmail.orl.lmco.com Received: from sunny.orl.lmco.com (sunny.orl.mmc.com) by orl.lmco.com (4.1/1.34.a) id AA26533; Wed, 30 Oct 96 11:02:27 EST Received: from bowling.orl.mmc.com by sunny.orl.lmco.com (4.1/GEA Sun server 2.7) id AA02070; Wed, 30 Oct 96 11:02:25 EST Received: by bowling.orl.mmc.com (4.1/1.34.a) id AA14368; Wed, 30 Oct 96 11:02:17 EST Date: Wed, 30 Oct 96 11:02:17 EST Message-Id: <9610301602.AA14368@bowling.orl.mmc.com> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Cory Raymer in car accident According to ESPN Cory Raymer was in car accident Tuesday. Apparently, he flipped his Blazer trying to avoid an elderly gentlemen who turned into his lane. Nobody was seriously hurt. TW From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 10:11:21 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA14085 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:11:14 -0600 Received: from castor.che.wisc.edu (castor.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.35]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12881 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:11:12 -0600 Received: by castor.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/23Feb95-0139PM) id AA01082; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:11:12 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:11:12 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610301611.AA01082@castor.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Cory Raymer hurt in car accident Corey Raymer was hurt in a car accident yesterday. He, another player, a trainer, and another person were in Raymer's Chevy Blazer. They were hospitalized but the injuries were reported as minor. Raymer was trying to avoid another vehicle, that was pulling into a driveway. The owner of the other vehicle was charged with wreckless driving. Brian From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 10:12:34 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA14113 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:12:24 -0600 Received: from castor.che.wisc.edu (castor.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.35]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA12914 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:12:23 -0600 Received: by castor.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/23Feb95-0139PM) id AA01106; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:12:22 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 10:12:22 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610301612.AA01106@castor.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Old news TW wins - I win the "too late" award for the day. Brian From shawkes@indiana.edu Wed Oct 30 11:22:10 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA15800 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:22:03 -0600 Received: from belize.ucs.indiana.edu (belize.ucs.indiana.edu [129.79.10.64]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA14400 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:21:59 -0600 Received: from ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu (shawkes@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu [129.79.10.44]) by belize.ucs.indiana.edu (8.7.3/8.7.3/1.12IUPO) with ESMTP id MAA29743 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (from shawkes@localhost) by ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu (8.7.6/8.7/regexp($Revision: 1.3 $) id MAA00492; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:21:27 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:21:27 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen Mccauley Hawkes X-Sender: shawkes@ophelia.ucs.indiana.edu To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: Brent Moss In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This isn't timely but I haven't seen it brought up before. I'm wondering what other people thought about how Brent was handled by the team after his drug arrest. I found it extremely distasteful that the Grid Iron Club did not mention him in the end of the year pictorial celebrating the seniors - I believe every year they take out a full page in the State Journal and put seniors pictures and a note of thanks. Moss was left out and it seemed everyone wanted to completely disassociate themselves from Moss. I found it quite sad after everything Moss had done for the program. Any thoughts? - Steve Hawkes UW '91 From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 11:33:14 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA15989 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:33:06 -0600 Received: from io.che.wisc.edu (io.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.39]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA14606 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:33:05 -0600 Received: by io.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/15Jun95-0428PM) id AA00817; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:33:04 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:33:04 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610301733.AA00817@io.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu, shawkes@indiana.edu Subject: Re: Brent Moss > This isn't timely but I haven't seen it brought up before. I'm wondering > what other people thought about how Brent was handled by the team after > his drug arrest. It WAS brought up at the time it happened. Just because you weren't around doesn't mean the list didn't exist then. :^) > I found it extremely distasteful that the Grid Iron > Club did not mention him in the end of the year pictorial celebrating the > seniors - I believe every year they take out a full page in the State > Journal and put seniors pictures and a note of thanks. Moss was left out > and it seemed everyone wanted to completely disassociate themselves from > Moss. I found it quite sad after everything Moss had done for the > program. Any thoughts? I think though most people understood it somewhat, they also shared your opinion. I know that I do. Brian From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Wed Oct 30 11:41:36 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA16234 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:41:31 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA14796 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:41:30 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:41:30 -0600 Message-Id: <199610301741.LAA14796@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:41:14 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: shawkes@indiana.edu, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Re: Brent Moss At 12:21 PM 10/30/96 -0500, Stephen Mccauley Hawkes wrote: >This isn't timely but I haven't seen it brought up before. I'm wondering >what other people thought about how Brent was handled by the team after >his drug arrest. I found it extremely distasteful that the Grid Iron >Club did not mention him in the end of the year pictorial celebrating the >seniors - I believe every year they take out a full page in the State >Journal and put seniors pictures and a note of thanks. Moss was left out >and it seemed everyone wanted to completely disassociate themselves from >Moss. I found it quite sad after everything Moss had done for the >program. Any thoughts? Yes. You're right. Abondoning people when they need help the most is the worst thing you can do not only as a football team, but as individuals. I'm not saying Moss should have remained active on the team...football is a privledge, but for what he accomplished over 3+ seasons, he should have received appropriate thanks. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From jjlander@sprynet.com Wed Oct 30 11:58:47 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA16469 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:58:42 -0600 Received: from m7.sprynet.com ([165.121.2.64]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA15180 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:58:40 -0600 Received: from 199.174.213.226 (hd02-226.compuserve.com [199.174.213.226]) by m7.sprynet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA08234 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:58:33 -0800 Message-ID: <327796D5.25C@sprynet.com> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 12:56:39 -0500 From: "Jonathan J. Newlander" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bucky Followers Subject: Re: Brent Moss References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > This isn't timely but I haven't seen it brought up before. I'm wondering > what other people thought about how Brent was handled by the team after > his drug arrest. I found it extremely distasteful that the Grid Iron > Club did not mention him in the end of the year pictorial celebrating the > seniors - I believe every year they take out a full page in the State > Journal and put seniors pictures and a note of thanks. Moss was left out > and it seemed everyone wanted to completely disassociate themselves from > Moss. I found it quite sad after everything Moss had done for the > program. Any thoughts? > - Steve Hawkes > UW '91 I agree completely. Moss made some mistakes...there's no disputing that. It kind of makes you wonder about priorities when a guy like Moss literally has a career ruined and a guy like Lawrence Phillips can beat his girlfriend and not only be a first round pick but even play in the Fiesta Bowl a scarce few weeks after the allegations (which he admitted he did) came public. What did Moss do? Sure, he did drugs and lied about it to coaches, teammates, etc. And without going into a major rant (and no, I'm not in favor of drug legalization or anything like that) I think drugs are fundamentally a self-destructive problem which can be overcome. If you're a veteran with a drug problem they send you for treatment; if you're a rookie, at the very least your draft position will be hurt (Warren Sapp anyone?) of you'll be untouchable (Moss). But being physically abusive to a spouse, girlfriend, etc? Oh, go ahead and make your millions anyway (Phillips, Warren Moon, OJ etc etc etc). OK...just so there's no misunderstanding. I'm not saying drugs are ok, nor are the deceptions which often accompany their use. But domestic violence should be no less of a concern, and since it involves physical violence and harm to others, should at least have the same stigma of drugs. OK...I'm done ranting now. Jonathan From smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 13:21:14 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA18228 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:21:08 -0600 Received: from humvee.doit.wisc.edu (humvee.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.20]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA16953 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:21:07 -0600 From: smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Received: from [144.92.96.163] by humvee.doit.wisc.edu; id NAA94786; 8.7.5/50; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:21:04 -0600 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 13:21:25 +0530 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu My comments on this Brent Moss thing: Two things stick out to me. First as earlier mentioned, the fact is he did a ton of good things for this program. Of course his drug porblems did some bad things too, so I guess I understand both sides. Second, the thing about Lawrence Phillips made me think about different schools. Obviously not all of our athletes are saints or geniuses. And it's difficult to really see some of the things that could be going on. But, my opinion is that Barry has built a clean program. There have been very few problems with the law/drugs/acedemics amongst his players. I see Cecil Martin and Tony Simmons in the computer lab all of the time. While they're sometimes just doing email or internet stuff, a lot of times they're working on papers or studying. I seriously doubt Phillips would have had the same fate here. I realize that there's no way that Wisconsin football is perfect in this sence, but overall, maybe another positive in a season where a lot of negatives have shown through is that Barry runs a pretty clean program. steve snyder From BadgerRoy@aol.com Wed Oct 30 15:21:40 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA19988 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:21:30 -0600 Received: from emout20.mail.aol.com (emout20.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.46]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA19049 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:21:27 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout20.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA15470; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:21:21 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 16:21:21 -0500 Message-ID: <961030162120_1382069007@emout20.mail.aol.com> To: saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: Optimism In a message dated 96-10-29 12:31:07 EST, saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu (Brian Saunders) writes: << If we had a Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, or Minnesota intermixed with the Ohio State, Penn State, and Northwestern games, it might have made a big difference. >> That is true. However, it doesnt change some of the deficiencies in Barry's system which continually arise. These need to be addressed. The program is not in shambles, but I think there are some valid concerns regarding the coaching staff, coaching decisions and the system. From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 15:41:48 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA20340 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:41:43 -0600 Received: from castor.che.wisc.edu (castor.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.35]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA19461 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:41:42 -0600 Received: by castor.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/23Feb95-0139PM) id AA03317; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:41:42 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:41:42 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610302141.AA03317@castor.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: The latest firestorm Last night, WISC-TV3 had an editorial where they defended Barry from the people that are supposedly saying "fire the bum". What I want to know is who is saying "fire Barry". This forum tends to be far more negative than most I have seen, and yet I've seen only one post asking for him to be fired (and I don't think it was entirely serious). I think most people simply are asking valid questions. It appears the "Barry is God for getting Wisconsin a Rose Bowl" gang is building up this fire-Barry strawman so they can defend him. Sad... In the "moron" category, apparently Brad Childress's children are being taunted at school. Gee, these kids are what, only 2 years late? :^) Brian From enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu Wed Oct 30 15:50:40 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA20554 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:50:31 -0600 Received: from uwwvax.uww.edu (uwwvax.uww.edu [140.146.128.10]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA19642 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:50:29 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:50:29 -0600 Message-Id: <199610302150.PAA19642@lucy.cs.wisc.edu> Received: from @uwwvax.uww.edu ([140.146.152.27]) by uwwvax.uww.edu (MX V4.2 AXP) with SMTP; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 15:50:11 CST X-Sender: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu, Bucky Badger s Followers From: enslinj@uwwvax.uww.edu (Jonathan C. Enslin) Subject: Re: The latest firestorm At 03:41 PM 10/30/96 -0600, Brian Saunders wrote: >Last night, WISC-TV3 had an editorial where they defended Barry from the >people that are supposedly saying "fire the bum". What I want to know is >who is saying "fire Barry". This forum tends to be far more negative than >most I have seen, and yet I've seen only one post asking for him to be fired >(and I don't think it was entirely serious). I think most people simply are >asking valid questions. It appears the "Barry is God for getting Wisconsin >a Rose Bowl" gang is building up this fire-Barry strawman so they can >defend him. Sad... > >In the "moron" category, apparently Brad Childress's children are being >taunted at school. Gee, these kids are what, only 2 years late? :^) No kidding. Ya think that Childress would have seen this coming a couple of years ago and changed their names by now. Jon Jonathan C. Enslin Director of Development and Associate Director University of Wisconsin - Whitewater Foundation Whitewater, WI 53190 (414) 472-1482 From fdeising@rbvdnr.com Wed Oct 30 17:53:44 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA22574 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:53:40 -0600 Received: from hermes.rbvdnr.com (hermes.rbvdnr.com [156.46.64.11]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA21857 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:53:38 -0600 Received: by hermes.rbvdnr.com with Microsoft Exchange (IMC 4.0.837.3) id <01BBC68B.E6EA5010@hermes.rbvdnr.com>; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:58:05 -0600 Message-ID: From: "Francis W. Deisinger" To: Bucky Badger s Followers , "Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov" Subject: RE: Where do we go from here? Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:54:00 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.837.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree with these comments strongly. Samuel played very badly against MSU -- his line wasn't helping much but he threw bad passes on numerous occasions when good passes would have meant good scoring opportunities. And does everyone remember the unbelievable missed opportunity against NW when Cecil Martin was wide open 35 yards down field (and with a sure td ahead of him) -- Samuel threw a Bevell - like wounded duck. I think he's got a lot of talent, but it's time to throw his job -- and almost EVERY job -- open. I'm not talking about preparing for next year, I think that's somewhat unfair to this year's players. I think you've gotta do it because we're losing NOW. If Samuel's the best guy, fine, but I remember the fabulous performances Zanders and White had in the spring game -- and then Kavanagh beat them both out. Give them the ball and see what they can do with it. WHAT THE HELL DO WE HAVE TO LOSE!!!? ---------- From: Lafleur_t@dcgate.bls.gov To: Bucky Badger s Followers Subject: Where do we go from here? Date: Monday, October 28, 1996 6:41AM This year is history folks! Let's start getting some of the younger guys needed for next year in there. .... Samuel--I remain unconvinced. It's critical to try others at QB. Nothing against him, he just isn't hitting the open receiver often enough. If the coaches are afraid he will turn it over, get someone in who you DO trust. .... Tim LaFleur From fdeising@rbvdnr.com Wed Oct 30 17:55:48 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA22601 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:55:44 -0600 Received: from hermes.rbvdnr.com (hermes.rbvdnr.com [156.46.64.11]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA21886 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:55:42 -0600 Received: by hermes.rbvdnr.com with Microsoft Exchange (IMC 4.0.837.3) id <01BBC68C.3114ABE0@hermes.rbvdnr.com>; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:00:10 -0600 Message-ID: From: "Francis W. Deisinger" To: Bucky Badger s Followers , Mark Sonneborn Subject: RE: My faith's intact Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:56:00 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.837.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It was our old 70s rallying cry -- and sadly, it may be once again: "We may lose the game -- but we'll win the party!!" ---------- From: Mark Sonneborn Bottom line: being a Badger fan is about having fun, win or lose. I heard an MSU fan remark that "these Badger fans don't get it--they lost." I think they're the ones who don't get it. It's more fun to win, granted, but how many schools can boast this kind of spirit in a loss? (And a bad loss at that?) From fdeising@rbvdnr.com Wed Oct 30 18:15:26 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA23065 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:15:18 -0600 Received: from hermes.rbvdnr.com (hermes.rbvdnr.com [156.46.64.11]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA22200 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:15:17 -0600 Received: by hermes.rbvdnr.com with Microsoft Exchange (IMC 4.0.837.3) id <01BBC68E.ECE44860@hermes.rbvdnr.com>; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:19:44 -0600 Message-ID: From: "Francis W. Deisinger" To: Bucky Badger s Followers , "Mtoepit@aol.com" Subject: RE: Now I've Heard it All Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 18:15:00 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.837.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The truth is, I honestly believe we will not win more than two games -- either Purdue or Minnesota, then Hawaii. I also think it is MUCH more probable that we will lose ALL remaining games than that we will win as many as three. Purdue's had two weeks to get ready for us, which given our coaching brainlock is too much time. Minnesota plain hates us, wants the ax back, and has a good passing game. Iowa -- forget it, no chance. Illinois? It'll be Lou's last game. And if we go to Hawaii 3 -8, and 0 -8 in the Big Ten -- well, God help us but even the Rainbows might have some fun. Bob Morse is simply right -- we suck. We are a bad football team. We have a lot of good players, but we are a bad football team, and in fact we're getting worse. Now I think I'll go jump off a bridge. ---------- From: Mtoepit@aol.com .... One Final Thought: Leaving your heart aside, does anybody seriously think were going to beat Purdue this week? From saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 19:18:43 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA25589 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:18:35 -0600 Received: from io.che.wisc.edu (io.che.wisc.edu [128.104.170.39]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA23539 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:18:34 -0600 Received: by io.che.wisc.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/15Jun95-0428PM) id AA01507; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:18:33 -0600 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:18:33 -0600 From: Brian Saunders Message-Id: <9610310118.AA01507@io.che.wisc.edu> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: No more whining STOP WHINING! Thank you. :^) Brian From tdmilews@students.wisc.edu Wed Oct 30 19:35:29 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA26087 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:35:17 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id TAA23830 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:35:16 -0600 Received: from tski.resnet.wisc.edu by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id TAA58808; 8.6.9W/42; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:35:15 -0600 Message-Id: <199610310135.TAA58808@audumla.students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: tdmilews@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 19:35:10 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: "Todd D. Milewski" Subject: UW-Minnesota Minnesota hockey week is upon us again, even though it seems like we just swept them at the Great Dane a couple weeks ago. I think this week's games are going to be a big factor in what happens to the Badgers do the rest of this year. If we sweep the Gophs, I think we'll have a great year. Dauber told me that Minnesota is the team they hate the most, so sweeping them would, in my opinion, be the spark they need to finish in the top three of the conference. Should we split with UM, I still think we'll still surprise teams. In the first place, we will not finish eighth in the conference. Whoever had this idea (attn: WCHA coaches) put too much weight on the first month of the season last year, where we were beat by the schedule maker, and couldn't dig out of the hole until the last month of the season. I'm not even going to talk about Minnesota sweeping us, because I don't think it'll happen. Things to look for this weekend: 1. Both teams are 2-2 in conference, so this series means a lot for each, other than the rivalry. North Dakota surprisingly leads the conference at 4-0 so a Badger sweep may put us right up there with them. 2. Minnesota goalie Steve DeBus was in net for both Badger comeback victories last year at the Coliseum, while ex-UM goalie Jeff Moen was between the pipes for the Final Five loss. Moen graduated last year, so DeBus is (I believe) the #1 man. If the crowd really gets on him like they did last year, he may prove to be just as porous. 3. UW's two losses have been by 3-2 scores, while their wins have come rather impressively, 2-0 and 8-3 against St. Cloud and Denver, respectively. It's obvious that the Badgers really have to show up for BOTH games this weekend. 4. I hate Minnesota. All right, number four doesn't really belong on the list of 'things to look for,' but I thought it necessary to lighten up the list. Todd D. Milewski tdmilews@students.wisc.edu "I don't think they did their homework. We're not an eighth-place team." -Jeff Sauer, on WCHA coaches picking the Badgers to finish eighth in the conference. From mork@uiuc.edu Wed Oct 30 20:01:37 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA26770 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:01:32 -0600 Received: from ux9.cso.uiuc.edu (ux9.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.39]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA24278 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:01:31 -0600 Received: from dialup.cso.uiuc.edu (colt-37.slip.uiuc.edu [128.174.22.195]) by ux9.cso.uiuc.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA27721 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:01:29 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <327809C6.52AB@uiuc.edu> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:07:02 -0600 From: HM Reply-To: mork@uiuc.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bucky Badger Followers Subject: Re: Brent Moss References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Stephen Mccauley Hawkes wrote: > > This isn't timely but I haven't seen it brought up before. I'm wondering > what other people thought about how Brent was handled by the team after > his drug arrest. I found it extremely distasteful that the Grid Iron > Club did not mention him in the end of the year pictorial celebrating the > seniors - I believe every year they take out a full page in the State > Journal and put seniors pictures and a note of thanks. Moss was left out > and it seemed everyone wanted to completely disassociate themselves from > Moss. I found it quite sad after everything Moss had done for the > program. Any thoughts? > - Steve Hawkes > UW '91 I think part of the problem might have been the gang allegations he made after the incident. I do not remember the timing of this but Moss made some allegations made that there were a couple of gang members on the team that made a bad situation worse. To his credit he did not blow the whistle on any of the other players on the team with respect to drug use. And I'm quite sure there were and are others, (marijuana not crack). I worked at Riley's and often saw many of the players coming in to buy beer and on one occasion I remember seeing a linebacker (not a starter) wearing a shirt with a huge pot leaf on it. In my experience at two different schools - USC and UW - casual use of marijuana among a few of the players was not uncommon. I have a very good friend who graduated from Miami (FL) who said it was no different there. I think it would be difficult if not impossible to snuff it all out, the best you can hope for is that it is kept to a minimum. I imagine that in some programs there is an added sensitivity to it (PSU), and this is likely the case with the Badgers after the Moss incident. Let's hope the lesson is not soon forgotten. Harlan From Adam.S.Bass@students.Miami.EDU Wed Oct 30 20:24:00 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA26979 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:23:52 -0600 Received: from email.ir.miami.edu (email.ir.miami.edu [129.171.32.80]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA24567 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:23:50 -0600 Received: by email.ir.miami.edu id AA14763 (5.65c+/IDA-1.4.4 for bucky@cs.wisc.edu); Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:23:42 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:23:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Adam S. Bass" Subject: Re: PREDICTION To: Paul G Wenaas Cc: bucky@cs.wisc.edu, Adam.S.Bass@students.Miami.EDU In-Reply-To: <199610292033.OAA02053@muskie.cray.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Badger Red. What color is it in yours? Adam S. Bass abass@email.ir.miami.edu On Wisconsin! On Tue, 29 Oct 1996, Paul G Wenaas wrote: > So Adam, what color is the sky in your world? > > > > From owner-bucky@cs.wisc.edu Tue Oct 29 13:55 CST 1996 > > Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 14:47:50 -0500 (EST) > > Reply-To: Adam.S.Bass@students.Miami.EDU > > Sender: owner-bucky@cs.wisc.edu > > From: "Adam S. Bass" > > To: Bucky Badger s Followers > > Subject: PREDICTION > > Mime-Version: 1.0 > > X-To: Wisconsin mailing list > > X-Listprocessor-Version: 7.1 -- ListProcessor by CREN > > > > > > > > OK, I'm going to be the first person to predict it, you heard it here first: > > > > After starting out 3-4, Wisconsin will finish the season at 8-4 by > > running the table, including the team's first win since before the dawn > > of time at Iowa. > > > > It starts with an absolute pasting of Purdue this weekend. 49-10 > > > > > > Adam S. Bass > > abass@email.ir.miami.edu > > > > On Wisconsin! > > > > > From BadgerRoy@aol.com Wed Oct 30 20:27:42 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA27000 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:27:34 -0600 Received: from emout18.mail.aol.com (emout18.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.44]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA24605 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:27:32 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout18.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA13651; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:27:00 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:27:00 -0500 Message-ID: <961030212659_1746786769@emout18.mail.aol.com> To: fdeising@rbvdnr.com, bucky@cs.wisc.edu cc: Heifmo@aol.com, BFeiges@interaccess.com Subject: Overreacting In a message dated 96-10-30 20:16:25 EST, fdeising@rbvdnr.com (Francis W. Deisinger) writes: << The truth is, I honestly believe we will not win more than two games -- either Purdue or Minnesota, then Hawaii. I also think it is MUCH more probable that we will lose ALL remaining games than that we will win as many as three. Purdue's had two weeks to get ready for us, which given our coaching brainlock is too much time. Minnesota plain hates us, wants the ax back, and has a good passing game. Iowa -- forget it, no chance. Illinois? It'll be Lou's last game. And if we go to Hawaii 3 -8, and 0 -8 in the Big Ten -- well, God help us but even the Rainbows might have some fun. Bob Morse is simply right -- we suck. We are a bad football team. We have a lot of good players, but we are a bad football team, and in fact we're getting worse. >> C'mon. I think people are completely overreacting. The coaches have done a very poor job of making decisions during games, nobody on the team was prepared for MSU and I am as frustrated (or more) than anyone else. However, keep several things in mind. First, if we had not fumbled against NU and had won that game would any of you be sounding this pessimistic?? I doubt it. I wrote a long e-mail about my concerns and they were not related to the the NU fumble. They are issues that were rarely discussed anywhere before the OSU game brought several issues to the forefront. If we had beaten NU we would have been 4-2 and ranked about 20. Would people be down? Should Alvarez be judged because of one play or mistake? NO. The problem is the many other issues which he hasnt addressed. Those wont go away with a win, a loss or whatever until we see a change in philosophy. That is what concerns me. This team easily has enough talent to win every game left. If we can dominate OSU then we can certainly beat Iowa. Will we?? I dont know. The rest of the year will tell us a lot about the coaching staff and the program. How much heart do they have?? Still, it is absurd to say we cant win again. The MSU game was a tough game against a very underrated team. I was also frustrated by the coaching decisions and the refusal to open up the offense and also the refusal to give Dayne the ball in the second half. He had 10 carries in the first half and only 5 the rest of the day?? What kind of play calling is that. Anyway, we cant overreact to one or two decisions and trash the whole program. This week the Badgers will finally wake up and will respond with a big win much as they did against MSU last year. The concern is where they will go from there when they play Minnesota, Iowa, Illinois. If we go 3-1 in those games we will be eligible for a bowl game and we will beat Hawaii. From BadgerRoy@aol.com Wed Oct 30 20:27:55 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA27012 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:27:44 -0600 Received: from emout01.mail.aol.com (emout01.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.92]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA24609 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:27:43 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout01.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA01144; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:27:04 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:27:04 -0500 Message-ID: <961030212703_1147428177@emout01.mail.aol.com> To: Bucky@cs.wisc.edu cc: BFeiges@interaccess.com Subject: Rumors Well I have three good rumors from relatively reliable sources. Let's hope that the first two are true because it will help the program. First, word is that the coaches are taking the redshirt off of Onjai Bryant and he may start in place of Weems. This can only be a good thing. We have seen cant even stay near his shadow. Second, apparently there is some rumblings about changes in assistant coaches after the season. The most likely to be let go--largely due to their poor performances---are Jay Hayes and Jim Hueber. While other areas--secondary--have also been weak, Barry will probably keep Cassity and Brian White (RB's coach) because they have strong connections to Florida and California respectively. Third, due to a lack of playing time and the new signing of Peter Lee, word is that Mark Zanders is going to transfer, possibly to Illinois. I think this might be a big loss but apparently he grasped the system very slowly and has a poor work ethic in practice. Kavanaugh by contrast has picked things up very quickly and is right on Samuel's heels. From Sippycable@aol.com Wed Oct 30 20:37:53 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA27180 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:37:42 -0600 Received: from emout05.mail.aol.com (emout05.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.96]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA24767 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 20:37:40 -0600 From: Sippycable@aol.com Received: by emout05.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA08802 for bucky@cs.wisc.edu; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:37:36 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:37:36 -0500 Message-ID: <961030213735_1515699325@emout05.mail.aol.com> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Minnesota Football Tickets Who needs two? I've got two at face value $24. From BadgerRoy@aol.com Wed Oct 30 21:34:37 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA28475 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:34:32 -0600 Received: from emout12.mail.aol.com (emout12.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.38]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA25594 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:34:29 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout12.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA19320 for Bucky@cs.wisc.edu; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:34:28 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:34:28 -0500 Message-ID: <961030223426_1080334155@emout12.mail.aol.com> To: Bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Moss The surprising part to me about Brent Moss is that he isnt playing anywhere in the NFL. You look at how bad some of the backs in the league are and I am sure Moss would do much better. I had friends in St. Louis who said he completely outplayed Lawrence Phillips in the preseason and the fans wanted him to start. The way Phillips has bombed this year I think St. Louis is probably sorry they let him go. They could use a good runner. Phillips had three cracks from the goal line in the last game against Baltimore's pathetic run defense and couldnt get into the end zone. No question Moss gets in. p.s. Not surprising to anyone who saw him play at UW, Donny Brady has been getting toasted left and right in the NFL. The only surprise is that he is on a roster. ESPN Primetime did a whole segment showing him getting beat on about 4 plays and then holding and interfering on about three others. From BadgerRoy@aol.com Wed Oct 30 21:35:29 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA28489 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:35:22 -0600 Received: from emout08.mail.aol.com (emout08.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.23]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA25609 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 21:35:20 -0600 From: BadgerRoy@aol.com Received: by emout08.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA12028; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:34:48 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:34:48 -0500 Message-ID: <961030223446_1482154573@emout08.mail.aol.com> To: Bucky@cs.wisc.edu, BFeiges@interaccess.com, Forcls1@aol.com Subject: Interesting observations Here are some interesting facts which I found online in ESPN Sportzone: •Wisconsin is 14-13-3 overall since its Rose Bowl season, including victories this season over Eastern Michigan (2-7), Nevada-Las Vegas (0-9) and Stanford (2-5). •Wisconsin is 6-10-1 against teams with winning records in the past two plus seasons, 4-7 against ranked teams. •Wisconsin is 7-11-2 in the Big Ten since the Rose Bowl. UW's conference record is ahead of only Minnesota (2-18), Indiana (3-18) and Purdue (5-12-3) in that span. Along with Illinois (8-11-1), those three programs are prime candidates to undergo major overhauls at the end of the season. Wisconsin is ninth in Big Ten wins (18) since 1990 and leads only Minnesota (13) and Purdue (12). Wisconsin even trails Penn State (22), which did not begin conference play until 1993, and Indiana (19), which has lost its last 13 Big Ten games. •Wisconsin's Big Ten record of 13-12-3 since 1993 doesn't crack the first division in victories, trailing Ohio State (23), Penn State (22), Michigan (18), Northwestern (17) and Michigan State (15), and leaving them tied with Iowa and Illinois. There were several other interesting observations in BadgerPlus online. First, Bevell is an offensive coordinator at a small school. After losing the first game they are averaging a lot of points and yardage. HMMM, I think Bevell might be a nice change of pace from Childress. He didnt have all the physical tools but I think he would be a good coach. Also, there was an article about the Illinois recruits who are reconsidering their commitments to Illinois in light of Tepper's situation. One of them will be at the game this weekend. I hope Tepper stays--it can only help us in the long run--what happens if Illinois gets a real football coach?? From jnrosen@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu Wed Oct 30 22:25:39 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA29994 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:25:32 -0600 Received: from tiberium.circ.gwu.edu (tiberium.circ.gwu.edu [128.164.127.251]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA26523 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 22:25:30 -0600 Received: from gwis2.circ.gwu.edu (gwis2 [128.164.127.252]) by tiberium.circ.gwu.edu (8.8.0/8.6.12) with ESMTP id XAA07486 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 23:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (jnrosen@localhost) by gwis2.circ.gwu.edu (8.8.0/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA13892 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 23:25:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 23:25:22 -0500 (EST) From: Jeremy N Rosen To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: pot use Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Maybe I just knew the wrong people, but there were times during my five years in Madison when I knew more casual pot users than people who did not use it. Therefore, it comes as no surprise to me that some of the players use it. I don't see it (pot use only) as any more of a problem than a player who has a few beers every once in awhile -- both are fine as long as they are not abused. ---Jeremy Rosen "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, concerned citizens can change the world; indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."---Margaret Mead From BarryR@ssec.wisc.edu Thu Oct 31 07:03:55 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA03934 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 07:03:48 -0600 Received: from ssec.wisc.edu (ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.108.61]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA00627 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 07:03:47 -0600 Received: from msmail.ssec.wisc.edu (msmail.ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.116.35]) by ssec.wisc.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id HAA68391 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 07:03:46 -0600 Received: by msmail.ssec.wisc.edu with Microsoft Mail id <327895A4@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu>; Thu, 31 Oct 96 07:03:48 CST From: BarryRoth To: "BuckyList " Subject: UW-Purdue tickets Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 07:02:00 CST Message-ID: <327895A4@msmail.ssec.wisc.edu> Encoding: 4 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 I have 2 good tickets in section E for this Saturday's game. I'd like to get face value ($24 each) but might accept a bit less. Send email if you're interested... From MSONNEBO@lans.mha.org Thu Oct 31 07:11:54 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA04088 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 07:11:50 -0600 Received: from vixa.voyager.net (vixa.voyager.net [198.109.136.2]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id HAA00791 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 07:11:49 -0600 Received: from mailgtwy.mha.org (mailgtwy.mha.org [198.109.138.3]) by vixa.voyager.net (8.8.0/CICNet) with SMTP id IAA11524; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:11:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by mailgtwy.mha.org with Microsoft Mail id <3278B433@mailgtwy.mha.org>; Thu, 31 Oct 96 09:14:11 EST From: Mark Sonneborn To: "'Bucky list'" , "Francis W. Deisinger" Subject: RE: My faith's intact Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 08:10:00 EST Message-ID: <3278B433@mailgtwy.mha.org> Encoding: 13 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 >It was our old 70s rallying cry -- and sadly, it may be once again: "We may lose the game -- but we'll win the party!!"< I'd change your motto slightly: "We MIGHT win the game, but we WILL win the party." For 99% of schools, winning is 99% of what matters to fans--take away the wins and all the "atmosphere" in the world doesn't mean much. At UW, it's more like 80%. I don't see having fun no matter what as sad, I see that as a strength. From gort@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu Thu Oct 31 08:40:52 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA05284 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:40:47 -0600 Received: from ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (ux1.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.59]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA01729 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:40:46 -0600 Received: from [130.126.51.131] (maloy4.life.uiuc.edu [130.126.51.131]) by ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA14783; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:40:43 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:40:22 -0600 To: saunders@castor.che.wisc.edu, Bucky Badger s Followers From: gort@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Steve Gort) Subject: Re: No more whining At 7:18 PM 10/30/96, Brian Saunders wrote: >STOP WHINING! > >Thank you. :^) I agree. You guys are starting to sound like a cross between Illinois football fans and my Uncle Ken. He's the uncle who sits on the couch all day on Thanksgiving and yells at the TV telling the football players that even he could do better. Never mind the fact that he is about 50 pounds overweight and even in his prime he wasn't very athletic. -- Steve Gort Home: 205 W. William #201 Champaign, Il 61820 (217) 359-3907 Work: University of Illinois U-C 354 Burril Hall 407 S. Goodwin Urbana, IL 61801 (217) 333-2203 From prapple@cacd.rockwell.com Thu Oct 31 08:54:48 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA05427 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:54:43 -0600 Received: from stealth.cacd.rockwell.com (stealth.cacd.rockwell.com [131.198.9.1]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA01917 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:54:41 -0600 Received: by stealth.cacd.rockwell.com; id IAA09288; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:55:05 -0600 Received: from apollo1.cacd.rockwell.com(131.198.38.6) by stealth via smap (V3.1.1) id xma009277; Thu, 31 Oct 96 08:54:47 -0600 Received: from pc110417 by apollo1 with SMTP (1.37.109.8/16.2) id AA08341; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 08:54:16 -0600 Received: from cc:Mail SMTPLINK 2.1 by ccmgw1.cacd.rockwell.com id AA846773648; Thu, 31 Oct 96 08:48:37 cst Date: Thu, 31 Oct 96 08:48:37 cst From: "prapple" Encoding: 28 Text Message-Id: <9609318467.AA846773648@ccmgw1.cacd.rockwell.com> To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: Moss Moss was part of the St. Louis offense until he had a fall out with the running backs coach. He was upset about losing playing time to Phillips (even though Moss had very good numbers and was in contention for the starting job in the preseason) and got into an argument with the coach on the field. this led to him being cut by the team. The only thing that surprises me is that nobody else picked him up. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Moss Author: BadgerRoy@aol.com at ccmgw1 Date: 10/30/96 9:43 PM The surprising part to me about Brent Moss is that he isnt playing anywhere in the NFL. You look at how bad some of the backs in the league are and I am sure Moss would do much better. I had friends in St. Louis who said he completely outplayed Lawrence Phillips in the preseason and the fans wanted him to start. The way Phillips has bombed this year I think St. Louis is probably sorry they let him go. They could use a good runner. Phillips had three cracks from the goal line in the last game against Baltimore's pathetic run defense and couldnt get into the end zone. No question Moss gets in. p.s. Not surprising to anyone who saw him play at UW, Donny Brady has been getting toasted left and right in the NFL. The only surprise is that he is on a roster. ESPN Primetime did a whole segment showing him getting beat on about 4 plays and then holding and interfering on about three others. From LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Thu Oct 31 10:58:00 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA07226 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 10:57:49 -0600 Received: from shaggy.uwex.edu (shaggy.uwex.edu [144.92.105.17]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA04162 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 10:57:47 -0600 From: LUCIANI@printing.uwex.edu Received: from by shaggy.uwex.edu; id AC17707; 4.1/42; Thu, 31 Oct 96 10:57:39 CST Received: From SCOOBY/WORKQUEUE by charon1.uwex.edu via Charon-4.0-VROOM with IPX id 100.961031104520.576; 31 Oct 96 10:57:39 +600 Message-Id: Organization: University of Wisconsin-Extension To: BadgerRoy@aol.com, bucky@cs.wisc.edu Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 11:54:15 CST Subject: Donny Brady (was Brent Moss) Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Mac (v2.1.2) >p.s. Not surprising to anyone who saw him play at UW, Donny Brady has been >getting toasted left and right in the NFL. The only surprise is that he is >on a roster. ESPN Primetime did a whole segment showing him getting beat >on >about 4 plays and then holding and interfering on about three others. > I happended to catch a Ravens-Broncos game recently and almost filled my pants when I realized that the #25 starting at right corner for the Baltimore Ravens was good ole Donny Brady. I mean c'mon.....this guy had his hands full in college trying to cover. No one drafts him and before you know it he's starting in the NFL! In the words of Bill Murray..."something's wrong here.....somethings terrrrrrrrribly wrong! - Dave PS-any by the way......he got burned on every pass thrown his way..... From bkoenig@nicollet.isd507.k12.mn.us Thu Oct 31 14:49:48 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA11825 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 14:49:41 -0600 Received: from Nicollet.ISD507.K12.MN.US (Nicollet.ISD507.K12.MN.US [206.8.68.1]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id OAA08533 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 14:49:37 -0600 Received: from [206.8.68.98] ([206.8.68.98]) by Nicollet.ISD507.K12.MN.US (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA05877 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 14:48:38 -0600 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 14:48:38 -0600 Message-Id: <199610312048.OAA05877@Nicollet.ISD507.K12.MN.US> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu From: bkoenig@nicollet.isd507.k12.mn.us (Brad Koenig) Subject: Mallory gone I am forwarding this from the Purdue List: >The speculation that IU would announce a coaching change today came true at >2:45pm. The AD announced that although Mallory had taken IU to new levels, >they were letting him go at the end of the season. IU has three remaining >games, and so does Mallory at IU. Evidently there was an evaluation at the >end of last season, and the AD decided to not make any coaching change at >that time. Again at mid-season, someone in the administration told the >AD to re-evaluate the program again. The decision was made at that time. >>From the sound of it, the AD wanted to let it go until the end of the >season, but he stated that there were too many rumors floating around >so they decided to make it public. The search is underway for a new >coach, but no possible replacements were mentioned at the press conference. >In an emotional speech, Mallory thanked everyone and basically said that he was >concentrating on the three remaining games of the season. Mallory leaves >Indiana at the end of the season as IU's most winning football coach >with a record of 68-75-4 and 6 bowl appearances. > > ____ _ _ >| _ \ _ ___ | |__ ___ _ __ __| | ____ Bob Richards >|____/| |/ \| _ \/ \| '__\/ |/ ___| wanker@expert.cc.purdue.edu >| _ \| | -- | | | | - | | | - |\___ \ Home Page At: >|_| |_|_|\___/|_| |_|\___/\_| \___/_____| | expert.cc.purdue.edu/~wanker >|___________________________________________/ 3-Peat outright Big10 Champs!! ****************************************************************************** Brad Koenig, Social Studies Chair Nicollet High School email bkoenig@nicollet.isd507.k12.mn.us One North Pine PO Box 108 Home: RR2, Box 183 Nicollet, MN 56074 Hector, MN 55342 School 507-225-3461 Home 320-848-6583 Fax 507-225-3536 From smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Thu Oct 31 15:42:06 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA12913 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 15:41:56 -0600 Received: from humvee.doit.wisc.edu (humvee.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.20]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA09564 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 15:41:55 -0600 From: smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Received: from [144.92.96.172] by humvee.doit.wisc.edu; id PAA51934; 8.7.5/50; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 15:41:51 -0600 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 15:42:14 -0600 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Donny Brady I have to admit this, though, I always thought Brady was a good cover guy, he was decent at running with wideouts, he just never looked for the ball. I always figured that was coaching as much as anything which maybe be what NFL scouts saw in him, but I haven't seen him in the NFL, maybe he can't run with the widouts anymore either. steve snyder From vector8@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 31 17:27:02 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA14809 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 17:26:56 -0600 Received: from dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.9]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA11644 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 17:26:53 -0600 Received: from lap-ca5-03.ix.netcom.com (vector8@lap-ca5-03.ix.netcom.com [206.214.145.131]) by dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA20636 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 15:26:49 -0800 Message-ID: <32788CE0.456A@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 03:26:24 -0800 From: Bob Rosenberg Organization: Vector Travel Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Cory Raymer Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I sent this earlier, but it doesn't seem to have gone through. Wall St. Journal reported that Cory Raymer has fractured vertebrae in lower back from accident and will be out 4-6 weeks. Bob R. From smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Thu Oct 31 21:50:52 1996 Received: from lucy.cs.wisc.edu (lucy.cs.wisc.edu [128.105.2.11]) by sea.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA17291 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 21:50:46 -0600 Received: from audumla.students.wisc.edu (students.wisc.edu [144.92.104.66]) by lucy.cs.wisc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA14787 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 21:50:45 -0600 From: smsnyder@students.wisc.edu Received: from @students.wisc.edu by audumla.students.wisc.edu; id VAA48218; 8.6.9W/42; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 21:50:44 -0600 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 1996 21:50:44 -0600 Message-Id: <199611010350.VAA48218@audumla.students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: smsnyder@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: bucky@cs.wisc.edu Subject: Re: Cory Raymer At 03:26 AM 10/31/96 -0800, you wrote: >I sent this earlier, but it doesn't seem to have gone through. >Wall St. Journal reported that Cory Raymer has fractured vertebrae in >lower back from accident and will be out 4-6 weeks. >Bob R. I heard some damage to his liver too, it's been weird because most of the stuff on it has been people saying that there were no major injuries and the news people seem real offhand about it, but then they say injured kidney and fractured vertebrae? To me that's pretty major. The story I heard was some old guy drove into Raymer's lane. steve snyder